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SPG is sometimes too OP - pls change mechanics

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Poll: Do you think SPGs need changes? (74 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 20 battle in order to participate this poll.

Does SPGs make WoT more addictive?

  1. No. SPGs frustrates both tanks and SPG players (39 votes [52.70%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 52.70%

  2. Yes. SPGs balances WoT (35 votes [47.30%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 47.30%

What do you think SPGs should be like?

  1. Slow reload snipers at long range (22 votes [29.73%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 29.73%

  2. Guns with good firepower but bad accuracy (29 votes [39.19%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 39.19%

  3. Mortars to shoot over houses and mountains (23 votes [31.08%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 31.08%

What part of SPG needs to be changed

  1. Damage (26 votes [18.57%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 18.57%

  2. Blast radius (32 votes [22.86%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 22.86%

  3. Accuracy (41 votes [29.29%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 29.29%

  4. Ammunition (17 votes [12.14%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 12.14%

  5. Gun elevation(ability to shoot over mountains) (24 votes [17.14%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 17.14%

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Der_aus_Deutschland #41 Posted 19 November 2017 - 09:35 AM

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Having played limited games with my Crusader SP, I don't have that much experience with SPGs, however, I can agree that they aren't always so accurate, but I would suggest that it also depends on the SPG and the player playing it, I have had battles in my HT where I am hit 2 times in a row whilst moving because I am simply not quick enough to evade. So much for bad accurracy.

 

With regards to change, I agree that the current system can be OP if two or more SPGs are in the battle, you just know that on an open map if you are first to get lit, you are going to get hit..  There are only so many places to viably go to on each map, and a good arty player knows where to pre-aim. 

 

The problem is also one of map design, not just poor arty .. I wonder what it would be like using the Grand Battles maps but with only 15 versus 15, where SPGs can't cover the whole map ?

 

Also, I would suggest that SPGs have a 3rd shell choice, an Area Denial shell ( much like the one that can be used in Strongholds) with a lower damage / stun factor but can cover maybe a whole grid square. If implemented correctly, (long relaod etc) it would also serve to help SPGs versus SPGs be a thing, since you could use it to destroy or weaken them, since most SPG players know where the best spots to sit are. It would mean that they can't sit comfly in a corner any more,

 

Or even just AoD shells, with a pre warning, Which means that campy TDS would have to choose either to sit out the damage or move, how many battles are won by one team only to lose against campy TDs who all sit in a corner, imagine Provhokva with such a shell, no more camping in the corners, other maps have the same problems.

 

Hmm, Yeah I think that would be the best solution, purely AoD shells, the added (added together) damage would be sufficient to make SPGs worthwhile, their ability to shift or move campy TDs would be great and with the pre-warning, it might mean that campers are nudged to move and are lit. The ability to pre-shoot SPG campy places would also mean that SPGs are no longer super safe and can directly attack each other.

 

That would be a tick in the box for me!


Edited by Der_aus_Deutschland, 19 November 2017 - 09:39 AM.


smileyrambo #42 Posted 04 January 2018 - 02:55 PM

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Ever since WG change how SPG works it became worst in my honest opinion. In the past you'll get one shot by arty if you are open, so what do you learn from that? Don't stay in the open, if you get hit its a training punishment, to that end player become more aware and constantly stay in cover. Once the change happen no matter what cover as long as the splash close enough its a performance penalty + high tracking chance, from then on if there is more arty in that match you'll just be permanently track.

 

This also create an issue where heavy tanks that is slow just camp like TD way behind the line because they are too afraid and not willing to take the risk of getting spotted. End up you have a bunch of genius just holding in "safe zone" and turtle as long as they can and hope others brave enough to open a line of opportunity. Many times you see match where one side send a kamikaze tank especially the hill climbing map, all he need is to spot the heavies then spg focus fire and now all the team is so afraid to go up kill they just run back down to camp in the forest. This kind of game isn't fun, its basically just boils down to who knew such tactic from the start, especially for scout. Sure there are many other ways and strategy besides going up the hill, but if your game basic mechanic force the majority to react with the intention to survive by just camping it has defeat the purpose of the game main and basic objective, which is battle and engagement. Why display the pride of a tank when all the game is forced to camp and wait not because it was a strategy but because of arty?

 

Ask any regular players, what is their thinking process when there is arty in a match, they would tell you if there is one they take a little risk moving from cover to cover, 2 arty they stay in big cover position early, 3 arty .... base camp, too risky to even cover 20% of the map. In the past arty reloading time is slow, giving time for heavy tank to repair and take cover if they did not get 1 shotted. Now arty reload time is so fast you can basically lock important tank till death, I did it a lot of times on my FV304 by waiting my teammate to fire a shot and track heavy tank, then I fire my first shot follow up just roughly 1 - 2 seconds apart and sure enough enemy used up his repair kit just to get track again by me and there is no way or chance to ever move again, not unless they wait past the refresh from repair kit.

 

From my perspective the spg change from WG is purely money motivated, they make arty their puppet to track players and with the fast reload speed threaten any that doesn't auto repair track to move to die on the spot, there is no different if you get one shot or pecked to death, the mechanic is design to force you to dap the repair key without even thinking, unlike the past when you get hit by arty you still could decide if you want to use your repair kit or not depending on your situation. The change was never sincere in solving the issue of the past, its just made so things move faster or more. They are also crunching out thicker and thicker armored premium tanks to make using AP rounds at the brink of usless but thats another topic for another day.

 

Right now SPG is just a mindless play, you find starting spot (usually around your base) and most of the time for the rest of the game you just sit there and wait for spotters to light up some target and fire away, with only 1 type of shell you don't have to think about your load out, you don't have to think in a SPG tank anymore because your reloading time is much faster and you can just spam in lighted area. The purpose and role of a spg had become a point and click, look at map, see things light up, spam away.

 

Now if WG is sincere in hearing opinions out here is a free suggestion to consider.

 

-Give SPG AP and HE round

 

AP - with AP round the accuracy is better, decent pen (base on their own tier) so its like a long range sky shell, dmg reduce to low the purpose of this is to take shots at exposed enemies.

HE - with HE the accuracy is less compare to AP, low pen ..... when hit enemy can track, but the area that it hits create a small patch of dust cloud, enemy is hidden within that cloud for a short time. The purpose of this is to hold enemy in position.

 

This would change how boring SPG was to a more interesting perspective. My explanation may be too brief, so I'll demonstrate with an example.

 

Lets say I'm running with my FV304, I go to a hidden position, enemy spotted, I decide to use HE shells, hit enemy, teammate blind shot into the cloud, hit some miss some. cloud effect over enemy back up came, fire another HE shell, this time in the middle of the field, you still see both side light up on map, just that in 3rd person or fps mode you can't see enemy outline, you can maybe see rough tank shadow. The HE shell would be a double edge sword function, you shell enemy to track them ,a chance for your enemy to decide if they want to repair to back up or take a chance at cross fire with what is in front of him. Second function is to smoke screen your own teammate position, useful when trying to move to risky place and need some arty cover to help, in this position arty is not just only all about spamming on exposed enemy, it has now had another purpose and function, which is provide smoke screen for your own ally to move or push. It can also be a decoy to hox enemy into thinking that because there is a smoke screen therefore some enemy tank must be there, trick enemy into spending shells on non target positions. 3rd function is same as what normal HE do, splash and injure crew etc.

 

Now both side on heavy fire, as a spg I wanna help teammate do some dmg, so I switch AP round, 110 pen 75 dmg 15 sec reload time, in this case I can pump some dmg to help fight against weaker tanks, forcing them to relocate I can also sort of defend my self if enemy get close if I choose AP over HE. With AP maybe you have shorter effective range compare to HE.

 

The idea is roughly in that sense, the adjustment can be made base on their own preference. The purpose is to adjust SPG to still be playing the same role but in a more active way, The advantage of spg all this while its the tank's ability at long range engagement, but should never be a couch potato tank.



Mother_Of_All_Rommel #43 Posted 04 January 2018 - 03:25 PM

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Nope, to much thinking do to, beats the purpose of leisure clicking. As a pretty dedicated spg player ( over 1k game in Lorr51 alone ), I prefer spg stay the way they are now. Still potent, but cannot carry game as good as other class. But I dont mind smoke stuff.

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ImperialStorm #44 Posted 05 February 2018 - 08:00 PM

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Imagine if artillery could drop smokeshells....

nabster1 #45 Posted 01 March 2018 - 07:24 PM

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All I know is that to many SPG have spoiled this game. When it first started they were good but now they dominate the game and if there are 3 of them there is no point trying to attack as they keep stunning you till you are destroyed.

I have used SPG but just sit there and let everyone else do the hard work. So I suggest using only 1 or 2 SPG per game at least that way we might be able to have some fun and not be target practice for the SPG campers.



Zynth #46 Posted 01 March 2018 - 10:08 PM

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View Postnabster1, on 01 March 2018 - 07:24 PM, said:

I have used SPG but just sit there and let everyone else do the hard work.

 

I know right?! It's amazing. I can read manga, brew coffee, play phone games and grind artillery all at once!

 

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OutCom #47 Posted 02 March 2018 - 09:31 AM

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View PostZynth, on 02 March 2018 - 12:08 AM, said:

 

I know right?! It's amazing. I can read manga, brew coffee, play phone games and grind artillery all at once!

 

Added bonus of being able to do assignments whilst tanking

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NameWasStolenStresslevel #48 Posted 07 April 2018 - 08:51 AM

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Yes i aggree arty is too op, however i must say that their low HP is a balancing factor!!

 

I think all arty should have a maximum HP of the average alpha dmg that a medium tank have in the respective tier, for example, at tier 8 artillery should have a maximum HP of 240, which is the average alpha dmg a medium tank have at tier 8, that would make them one-shottable, which is a good way to balance arty... A tier 10 arty should have a maximum of 320 hp and so on....

 

 

Here is how i deal with arty (blind firing them like this):

 


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Gordo_G #49 Posted 29 July 2018 - 04:42 AM

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Still mega stupidity and ignorance from the anti-SPG folks.

Go and grind them, learn about their strengths - currently little more than de-tracking devices that do a bit of damage and maybe a stun. Learn about their weaknesses, especially the higher tier SPGs - slow moving, very slow loading and aiming*, long time between firing and hitting (up to a measured 4 seconds* in extreme cases), poor penetration, poor Alpha (lucky to get half their supposed values for hits), very poor spotting range (means you can get very close without being spotted which with...), very low camo' values, (...even with paint, training and net means you can spot them a long time before you are spotted - which is why they are comparatively useless without spotters), slow to track round even when not tracked, even when zoomed in if the target moves enough for the vehicle to track round the damned things reset to zoomed out, etc.

 

Basically, if you are getting ripped by arty you need to have a good look at the guy in the mirror - that is where the main problem lies.

 

*that means if you shoot and move, or at least move every few seconds, you are reasonable safe - but considering the piss-poor accuracy, you could easily be hit by a wild shot, many times I've aimed where the enemy was only to see it move away from that point, but still hit it because the shot was so wide of the mark. You can also still be hit on the move, though, but it takes a lot of luck and skill (mostly the former) to figure out where the enemy may be seconds after firing - the compensation is it is hugely satifying to hit, even kill, a fast moving vehicle as they can move a long way between firing and hitting.


Edited by Gordo_G, 29 July 2018 - 04:44 AM.


Gordo_G #50 Posted 29 July 2018 - 04:49 AM

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View PostNameWasStolenStresslevel, on 07 April 2018 - 12:51 AM, said:

Yes i aggree arty is too op, however i must say that their low HP is a balancing factor!!

 

I think all arty should have a maximum HP of the average alpha dmg that a medium tank have in the respective tier, for example, at tier 8 artillery should have a maximum HP of 240, which is the average alpha dmg a medium tank have at tier 8, that would make them one-shottable, which is a good way to balance arty... A tier 10 arty should have a maximum of 320 hp and so on....

 

 

Here is how i deal with arty (blind firing them like this):

 

 

Aimbot?

Dyn_marw #51 Posted 27 August 2018 - 03:42 PM

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Just Remove Arty from the game...... Done,Fixed.

crazib #52 Posted 27 August 2018 - 06:56 PM

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View PostGordo_G, on 29 July 2018 - 04:49 AM, said:

 

Aimbot?

 

not aimbot, just good shooting and good awareness of using the hitmarker to pinpoint the spg position

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Mother_Of_All_Rommel #53 Posted 27 August 2018 - 08:10 PM

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View Postcrazib, on 27 August 2018 - 06:56 PM, said:

 

not aimbot, just good shooting and good awareness of using the hitmarker to pinpoint the spg position

Few succes I got are from mines and himmel. What namestolen did was really good, I nvr had succes doing that in large map, probably wasted already hundreds shot in prok trying to blind kill arty from hill :D


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