37 replies to this topic

[zktaichou]

This game is fun (at least for a time). But it is very excruciatingly frustrating if you do not spend any money. I believe everyone has a different experience when they play the game, so this is my story as a free-to-play player after almost 200 battles (free-to-play doesn't equal free-to-win btw, play doesn't equals win).

 

It was pretty fun at the start when all tiers had more or less the same armour and weapons, so it was rather fun. It was the later tiers that the game starts to go downhill and became stupidly frustratingly very unplayable. Just imagine when you've gotten your first tier 4 light tank, and it only has a 43mm armour pen. That effectively means when i get paired up with higher tier tanks, I do completely NO damage at point blank to EVERY ENEMY TANK. It was an auto-lose to me and I absolutely cannot do anything else except to waste my time and to be a complete useless ally to my teammates, which sucks big time. 

 

Now, if i need to upgrade the tank's weaponry, I will need exp. Now, there is two ways to achieve this. Either I continue losing every game until I unlock the upgrade, or I let other people carry me while i sit behind and do absolutely nothing. What kind of shitty fun is that? I've been stomped on by literally superior tanks with superior upgrades and crews and there is absolutely no way I can beat them. Unless I spend more time to get exp? Well, have fun losing yet another tens (or hundreds) more games until you reach there.

 

This game has potential, but I can't help but feel that the game's system was designed into forcing you to spend money by giving you a deliberate unsavoury experience by the penalties that accompanies not buying any premium items in the game. The things that you get without spending money feels like trash in this game when compared to your teammates.

 

The game is definitely playable when you have everything upgraded and good to go, but to get from point A to point B without spending real cash, the process is just horrible enough that I couldn't even remotely recommend this to any of my friends. The new player experience to me feels really terrible, and i do not think this bodes well for the future of the game. But then again, I suppose the developers are only more interested in keeping the paying players happier than making a more balanced game or experience to accommodate non-paying players.

 

So free-to-win model? That's pretty much laughable =) Just my 2 cents on this game.

[Proloser]

100% free to win. No amount of payments will make you a good player. I can grind up an entire line without paying a cent and still win.

 

Of course, when tanks are stock they are disadvantaged, but that's just part of the grind.

 

Obviously Wargaming need to make money somehow. If the game was really easy to get to tier 10 then no one would consider paying money for free xp or credits. If no one did that, then RIP servers.

 

I'm grinding up a second account and while I admit that it's a painful grind, it doesn't mean that the game isn't free to win; once you get your tank fully upgraded then you will be fine. 

 

FYI 200 battles is not even a scratch on the surface of how many battles you will need before you can actually get good at the game. WoT is about smart thinking and positioning; you can't buy the experience needed to play the game well.

 

 

TL;DR; version:

 

- Not pay to win

- The game is 100% free to win

- Money only speeds up the process of unlocking tanks; it doesn't give wins in the long run and a new player skipping all the way to tier 10 will be in a far worse position than someone who has ground from tier 1.

[The_Red_Baron_of_Germany]

With your 200 games, you haven't even scratched the surface of WOT. Admittedly the grind towards good tanks is hard when you start specially if you're only a beginner. I suggest, if you still have the will power to grind towards the illusive good tanks. Play Russian med or heavies. The grind isn't as hard, since the tanks are good when stock (most) and rewarding when upgraded.

- if the grind is too frustrating then play your fully upgraded tanks.
- Even if you pay WG, the grind will still be painful since you are new. (get good)

- Try and play till tier 5 or 6, I bet you'll like the game more by then.

[Mother_Of_All_Rommel]

WOT is not true skill based game for sure. But you are not paying to get win nor skills. Pay for advantage are true in grind part, but no amount of gold will make you a uni if you suck at it.

[Proloser]

jessica_raven, on 08 January 2017 - 11:18 PM, said:

WOT is not true skill based game for sure. But you are not paying to get win nor skills. Pay for advantage are true in grind part, but no amount of gold will make you a uni if you suck at it.

 

I beg to differ; personal skill is the only thing that separates a good player from a bad player. Everyone gets the same luck, it's just the better players that can swing it their way more often.

[iDd_Sloth]

Even if you're in a fully upgraded tank or a good premium tank, you'll still get your "behind" handed to you on a platter in a Tier VIII and above games.

Experience is the best teacher,  no amount of shortcut can help you with that.

And with the games under your belt and you're already complaining, you may need 3K more than that to at least get a bearing.

The game is free and like any other FREE to play platform it still needs money to keep it's wheels turning and they need to make a buck or two.

Here, you pay to progress and still even getting a fully upgraded tank doesn't mean an instant win ... you still have to fight for that win.

[Proloser]

^ that's better put than what I said, +1.

 

Only thing I'd say more is that you'd get your behind handed to you in any tier if you're inexperienced.

[Mother_Of_All_Rommel]

Not really, its grind/skill(?) based, not true skill based. The advantage stack up with numbers of game played, in game advantage, not just player exp of handling the game.
Take a true skill based game, say Dota ( comparison purpose, hope this pass moderation ). Take 2 uni of same skills, and give them 2 acc with E75. 1 acc got 1000 game with E75, another just 15. Even with same skill lvl, the one with 1000 game in E75 will wreck the other due to the crew skill.
This grind advantage, does not exist in Dota. Even you played Lanaya for 10k games, next time you start, Lanaya will be lvl 1 hero, not 10. And the opponent hero will be equally lvl 1 to.

[The_Red_Baron_of_Germany]

jessica_raven, on 09 January 2017 - 12:15 AM, said:

Not really, its grind/skill(?) based, not true skill based. The advantage stack up with numbers of game played, in game advantage, not just player exp of handling the game.
Take a true skill based game, say Dota ( comparison purpose, hope this pass moderation ). Take 2 uni of same skills, and give them 2 acc with E75. 1 acc got 1000 game with E75, another just 15. Even with same skill lvl, the one with 1000 game in E75 will wreck the other due to the crew skill.
This grind advantage, does not exist in Dota. Even you played Lanaya for 10k games, next time you start, Lanaya will be lvl 1 hero, not 10. And the opponent hero will be equally lvl 1 to.

 

you're just nit picking.

[zktaichou]

The main point that I'm trying to make here is not about skills being irrelevant here, to the extent where it's all pay to win, but that even being a skilled player that you are, you simply cannot win because you have inferior equipment and crews. Imagine going to race against a race car with just a wheel barrow. You may have the skills to truly master every part of the vehicle you're handling, but you'll be severely limited in what you can do with a mediocre vehicle (I wonder how do you utilise your skill if you're given a tank with penetration value less than the minimum armour value in the opposing team, with 20km/h max speed and stock crews, you're rendered effectively useless before the game even starts).

 

A skilled player can often turn the tide of any battles, but only with the right tools. And to get the tools, you have to earn them. To earn them, you have to gain experience and credits, and the way to do it faster is to win. If grinding towards that goal is filled with so many losses, I think it really defeats the purpose of a true fun game. So how do you gain an advantage then? This is where the premium part comes in, and it helps accelerate your progress by *winning*.

 

I think it's not entirely fair to say the game is not pay to win based solely on the end game. The pay to win concept is fairly true for 90% of the grinding process, and is pretty much relevant until you have gained better leverage against the average leverage progression of the player base, at which point skills become a much bigger factor as compared to the tools that you have at your disposal.

 

Also, 200 battles can be enough for some. In one game, I was able to deflect 1k+ damage on a mediocre T4 tank that I used with all superior tanks in the match up  (I'll let you figure out how I did that, but for the simplicity of things, we'll just say that it indicates my lack of experience for WoT's end game), but I do draw my points from other countless games that I've played and the experience I had with them. If I have to invest a few thousand more battles in order to start enjoying WoT without the penalties and demoralising experience, then I hope I can convince you to play Maple Story until you have hit the max level before you start enjoying the game. It's just too big a leap to make for most. Inherent advantage will always trump over skills until the gap is narrowed to a point where skills truly shines above all.

[The_Red_Baron_of_Germany]

so.. basically you just want to have the best equipment possible very quickly, without paying or playing for it. WOT is a f2p game, it's designed to be very rewarding yet very frustrating at the beginning so you'd want to spend money to QUICKLY progress the tech tree to get the better tanks you are seeing in your current match maker (tier 10, so you'd be the top dog every time). WOT won't hold your hand while you cry and whine about not getting the best stuff right away buddy. Every single tank in the game have weakness that can be exploited so you could carry the team to victory even with inferior equipment, learn to exploit those weakness and play to your tank strengths. Every single game of WOT is different so you'd need to adapt to it every single time, if you can't then you are free to pick up another game, we aren't forcing you to play a game that you don't find entertaining.

[The_Salty_Brit_]

It's definitely free-to-play, you can download the client and start straight away, heck they've even upgraded the Tier 1 tank crews to 100% (the used to be 50%) and IF you pay real-money you DO increase your chances of winning*, even at the lower tiers, and I agree with the frustration part, but look at it this way:

 

Time is money, you get paid to do a job, and your skills are worth a certain amount, let's say 35$ an hour, so an hour of YOUR time is worth 35$, and YOU know how much work you need to do in order to achieve that 35$ per hour wage. You also need tools to work with, and they cost money too, and the better quality the tools, the more likely you are to be succesful, which gives them a value too!

 

So to play this game it takes time, and to be succesful, you need the right tools, and with the right tools, you can be rewarded with more achievements, the same as in your real life.

 

All YOU have to figure out, is how much an hour (or whatever length of time you play for ) is worth to you, and the same as your Boss,decide how productive you are in that hour,  and whether you could be more productive if you had an easier task (the same as in real life). 

 

Figure out in your own mind, how much it is worth to you, to have an easier and more succesful grind, and also consider whether the enjoyment / challenge or sense of achievement you might have, once you have mastered the game (albeit at a monitary cost) is worth it.

 

Answer YES, buy some Premium time and get to your goals quicker, answer NO, then just relax and take your time, which is more frustrating but less rewarding.

 

*winning: Of course, having a fully upgraded tank with good crew skills and plently of Premium ammunition etc INCREASES your chances of winning the battle (or at least helping to win) more than a stock tank, and mostly players have to PAY for the privilege.

 

[JOC469]

OP seems to have had a bad run in the AMX40 and wants.

 

Try shooting the tracks and get assisted damage. Or go down another line and build up free exp to use and upgrade the modules. Or keep playing some of the other tanks and build up your free exp that way.

[aldwin97]

"Not a true skill based game"

 

 

[Inglorious_Aussie_Tanker]

Every tank has it's weak spots, and there Tanks that Tier 7 which can be Turretly Penned by Tanks in Tier 3 and lower.

Learning what your Tank "CAN DO" is just as important as what it Can't.

If it can't Pen a Tank using AA, then don't use AA.  Use sniper View, and try the Commanders Hatches, Driver Slits, Turret Sides or Rears.  Flank them and try shooting their sides, or Engine.

As mentioned above, you shoot the tracks out, crippling a Tank for your team to destroy.

Don't underestimate the Abilities of 100% trained crew either.  You'd be surprised the difference in accuracy and view between a Low skill and 100% crew.

Also don't forget all those FREE "Personal Reserves" that give various Bonus's to help you along.

[Ezz]

To be fair WoT isn't as P2W as other games, but it's a bit worrying the direction the devs are going. It seems a few of the bean counters got into the balance department and decided it was time to cash in on their cow.

[Mother_Of_All_Rommel]

Ezz, on 09 January 2017 - 06:53 AM, said:

To be fair WoT isn't as P2W as other games, but it's a bit worrying the direction the devs are going. It seems a few of the bean counters got into the balance department and decided it was time to cash in on their cow.

Market follow demands, not ideals. If the major playerbase are fine with p2w concept, then it should go that way. 

[Ezz]

jessica_raven, on 09 January 2017 - 11:23 AM, said:

Market follow demands, not ideals. If the major playerbase are fine with p2w concept, then it should go that way. 

 

One suspects it's something closer to 'if profits go up, then it should go that way'. The ideals of a competitive game are just that. Tho like i said, at least things could be worse.

Edited by Ezz, 09 January 2017 - 09:27 AM.

[Otakubouzu]

Well, reading to OP's second post i can get why he think WoT is P2W, and i think to some degree he got point, especially on crew training matter.

 

But on this statement:

Block Quote

So how do you gain an advantage then? This is where the premium part comes in, and it helps accelerate your progress by *winning*.

Well, premium content do help players on grinding. And it certainly helps player to get advantages by getting better equipment/modules more quickly.

But to say premium contents help player on winning, certainly not accurate. 

Especially when some top modules from one tank are transferable to next tank, most of the case it is enough to carry the players until they got better, final equipment. In fact, you will find that many times a tank will use same cannon as it predecessor has *coughT32coughAMXM4*.

You will also find fun fact that in some nation, two different class lines can complement each other module-wise (especially UK medium-heavy lines) so grinding is far easier.

So yeah, it help accelerate your progress, but it won't really help you with winning.

 

[chips_otoole]

 

Dude you haven't played 200 games yet! Wait until you have to grind out a T9. But it can be done, play a variety of tanks soon enough you will find your dream tank. And grinding will be fun.

Oh and it's not really tanks until T5!

Edited by chips_otoole, 09 January 2017 - 01:53 PM.