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The end of the last tier6 CWs season coincided with dramatic decline for WOT


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BrutalOlyx #1 Posted 14 September 2018 - 10:42 AM

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Global map season 5 lasted from early January 2017, until late March 2017, after which Tier 6 clanwars was abandoned.

 

If you look at the following graphs, you can see that this coincided with the dramatic collapse in player numbers, as well as a dramatic decline in active players that were members of a clan. This trend is consistent across all servers, quite pronounced on the US server in particular.

 

http://wot-news.com/...ver/sea/norm/en

 

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Certainly I notice a massive drop in clan members logging on when the clan wars seasons end, and I bet the bulk of you guys in a clan notice the same thing. This is what happened to WOT when they killed the tier6 clans, Clan activity is in many cases the glue that keeps players logging on, there was no more clan activity for those players affected and they drifted away never to return

 

When people on this forum advocate for tier6 clanwars, it is not for them personally. I barely play tier6 myself, but fully understand how important it is for the health of the clan culture and the game itself

 

Admins, you need to stop listening to the self appointed elites in this echo chamber of a forum. And if you have any influence on the powers that be over in Eastern Europe, you believe should advocate for a reversal of this poor decision and start rebuilding. 

 

 

 


Edited by BrutalOlyx, 14 September 2018 - 10:43 AM.


wasaabi #2 Posted 14 September 2018 - 10:48 AM

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Don't confuse correlation with causation, most players are not in clans.

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_HoPeY_ #3 Posted 14 September 2018 - 10:51 AM

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Unsure if it was the removal of tier 6 CW that caused this or if for the first time on this server it was the removal of the ability to use low tiers (tiers 1 to 10 in tier 10 CW). One or the other though killed off interest and activity dramatically.

_HoPeY_ #4 Posted 14 September 2018 - 10:52 AM

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View Postwasaabi, on 14 September 2018 - 10:48 AM, said:

Don't confuse correlation with causation, most players are not in clans.

 

But a lot of players use to be in active clans and active clan tags showed via XVM. Not so much now hey.

IMC_Jimmy #5 Posted 14 September 2018 - 11:00 AM

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I mean yeah there is a graph thats on a decline, but take into consideration other games that have come out that maybe people are playing instead of tanks. Also family commitments,  irl stuff that people can't commit the time anymore. I know for a fact with myself for instance i don't play as many battles a night than i used to a year ago, due to work and clan commitments. So i think there is alot more than meets the eye than the removal of tier 6 and not being allowed to take tier 1 tanks in clan wars.
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mttspiii #6 Posted 14 September 2018 - 11:51 AM

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I'm sorry BOryx, but I looked at your source (let's share sources coz I'm lazy to have a commonality of facts) and, assuming you got your timeline for tier 6 CW being January to March 2017 for ASIA (otherwise we'd both be wrong in our premises and all this is moot), could see the reverse: playerbase improved after tier 6 CW was abandoned

 

Fig. 1: A general playerbase decline is notable from way back, even before Wot-news started logging. That green line roughly shows a normal line; it shows a decline; bonus points for this sentence because it rhymes.

 

Even then, there's a noticeable spike in that graph: the one after March 2017. Let's look deeper, eh?

 

Fig. 2: The red line indicates CW Season 5, the one with tier 6 CW. After tier 6 CW died, on March 2017, there was a noted spike in player population the month after it ended, on April 2017. But you'd say aha, that's because people thought tier 6 CW was still active so they signed up, late, on April 2017, just after WG and the Big Clan Cartel killed off tier 6 CW.

 

Except there's an even bigger spike at around June/July 2017, when it's been established that tier 6 CW is dead. It's like the collective playerbase waited to confirm if tier 6 CW is dead first before finally going back to playing WoT.

 

But you'd say, no, our concern is CW, not the general population. Indeed, in your own words:

View PostBrutalOlyx, on 14 September 2018 - 10:42 AM, said:

Certainly I notice a massive drop in clan members logging on when the clan wars seasons end, and I bet the bulk of you guys in a clan notice the same thing. This is what happened to WOT when they killed the tier6 clans

 

Fig. 3: A graph showing clan membership in proportion to total playerbase population. The red line shows Season 5 (tier 6 CW era). The purple line shows the era just after tier 6 CW died: there's a sudden spike in in-clanned players after tier 6 CW died. And that's a proportion, which already took in the increase in general player numbers already.

 

Quite simply, after tier 6 CW died, a lot of players started playing WoT, and of those players, much more of them joined clans than ever before. It's as if ASIA was relieved that tier 6 CW died and started playing WoT again after tier 6 CW's demise.

 

Correlation and causation perhaps?


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_HoPeY_ #7 Posted 14 September 2018 - 11:58 AM

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Shame you don't have a graph to show when clan tags started disappearing via XVM due to lack of CW activity :)

 

Good info though.



mttspiii #8 Posted 14 September 2018 - 12:06 PM

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View Post_HoPeY_, on 14 September 2018 - 11:58 AM, said:

Shame you don't have a graph to show when clan tags started disappearing via XVM due to lack of CW activity :)

 

Good info though.

 

BOlyx's source didn't include clan tags. Blame them :P

 

As I remember it though, XVM clan tags are not indicative of CW activity, partly because XVM is lazy in updating their clanicons folder (no one cares for ASIA after all). They initially made it for the top 200/500/1000 clans per server, and after CW imploded after Campaign 3, most of the old clans reformed and got new clans, but the clanicons did not update as fast. So you'd have powerful CW clans running around with no clan icons for months (or for [KYLIE], even up to today) until XVM checks "on that small server at the Equator".

 

That said, do note that XVM clan tags note the powerful clans. You and BOlyx were fighting for the smaller, weaker tier 6 clans, the clans that won't show up at XVM because they're too weak to do so. So you really shouldn't be noticing the XVM clan tags in your crusade for tier 6 CW; XVM clan icons are only a part of the Big Clan Cartel along with WG.


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_HoPeY_ #9 Posted 14 September 2018 - 12:08 PM

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View Postmttspiii, on 14 September 2018 - 12:06 PM, said:

 

BOlyx's source didn't include clan tags. Blame them :P

 

As I remember it though, XVM clan tags are not indicative of CW activity, partly because XVM is lazy in updating their clanicons folder (no one cares for ASIA after all). They initially made it for the top 200/500/1000 clans per server, and after CW imploded after Campaign 3, most of the old clans reformed and got new clans, but the clanicons did not update as fast. So you'd have powerful CW clans running around with no clan icons for months (or for [KYLIE], even up to today) until XVM checks "on that small server at the Equator".

 

That said, do note that XVM clan tags note the powerful clans. You and BOlyx were fighting for the smaller, weaker tier 6 clans, the clans that won't show up at XVM because they're too weak to do so. So you really shouldn't be noticing the XVM clan tags in your crusade for tier 6 CW; XVM clan icons are only a part of the Big Clan Cartel along with WG.

 

DETOX was pretty small and we always had tags when active. KELLY and the likes too. Stop doing CW and they go quickly though.

mttspiii #10 Posted 14 September 2018 - 12:18 PM

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Congratulations, DETOX and KELLY are in the top 1000 clans of ASIA :medal:

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_HoPeY_ #11 Posted 14 September 2018 - 12:47 PM

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Cause there's only like 100 left :facepalm:

mttspiii #12 Posted 14 September 2018 - 01:06 PM

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View Post_HoPeY_, on 14 September 2018 - 12:47 PM, said:

Cause there's only like 100 left :facepalm:

 

No, as the graphs from BOlyx's source said, there's more clans, not less Hopey. All those nice graphs and you dinnae notice that :(

 

CW activity, on the other hand, is WG ASIA's personal data; I have no graphs for that. But then, I'd actually agree with you that there's more CW activity when there was tier 6 CW, because your clans were playing in it. If there was tier 4 CW, there'd still be more CW activity because PBKAC is playing in it. If there was tier 2 CW, there'd still be more CW activity because UNICU and the various tier 2 sealclubber clans would be in it.

 

CW is a competitive end-game, much like F1 racing; if we lower the tiers included in CW just because there's not enough CW activity then it's not really an end-game; just Random Battles with Risk. It'd be like saying "There's only 20 cars in F1, not enough activity. Let's include Commodores!"


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Centurion_IRL #13 Posted 14 September 2018 - 01:10 PM

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Not everyone joins a clan to do clan wars and not every active clan does CW either.

 

Players join for mates, platoons and whole bunch of other reasons.

 

T6 clanwars didnt kill the player base, it killed clan wars and that is why thankfully WG got rid of it.

 

Just let it go, no matter how you chose to read or present data Tier 6 clan wars is gone, move on.


Edited by Centurion_IRL, 14 September 2018 - 01:30 PM.

                                                                                                                                 
 
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_HoPeY_ #14 Posted 14 September 2018 - 01:19 PM

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View Postmttspiii, on 14 September 2018 - 01:06 PM, said:

 

No, as the graphs from BOlyx's source said, there's more clans, not less Hopey. All those nice graphs and you dinnae notice that :(

 

CW activity, on the other hand, is WG ASIA's personal data; I have no graphs for that. But then, I'd actually agree with you that there's more CW activity when there was tier 6 CW, because your clans were playing in it. If there was tier 4 CW, there'd still be more CW activity because PBKAC is playing in it. If there was tier 2 CW, there'd still be more CW activity because UNICU and the various tier 2 sealclubber clans would be in it.

 

CW is a competitive end-game, much like F1 racing; if we lower the tiers included in CW just because there's not enough CW activity then it's not really an end-game; just Random Battles with Risk. It'd be like saying "There's only 20 cars in F1, not enough activity. Let's include Commodores!"

 

But most of us drive Commodores (or similar), only the elite can afford a F1 car. Should us drivers just stop driving? or just skip track events?



_HoPeY_ #15 Posted 14 September 2018 - 01:21 PM

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View PostCenturion_IRL, on 14 September 2018 - 01:10 PM, said:

 

Removing T6 clanwars didnt kill the player base, it killed clan wars

 

 

 

Agreed.

s70blackhawk #16 Posted 14 September 2018 - 01:22 PM

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Well, I can say the correlation is the causation in ADF case. Tier 6 removal killed CW for us as a small clan. We did Tier 8 for a little while, but got sick of tank locking and not being able to field a team of 10, let alone 15 Tier X.

Causation also lead to most of our clan not even playing the game anymore, because the game is that rife with other BS that we just don't want to put up with that anymore. CW kept us playing at least. Even for just logon to do 1-2 battles and then call it quits for the night.

 

So many self appointed elite have said CW is riddled with other problems, problems that only apply to other servers or large clans. 

If one clan is a clear example of Tier 6 removal stopping them from playing CW, then how many others?

 

All this talk on the other thread doesn't address the new players coming into the game, or new/old small clans wishing to play a different game mode. 

 

To be clear: We are not doing CW for the rewards, we are doing CW for the battles with team mates who aren't pubbies. Strat mapping. Having fun whilst winning or losing.


Edited by s70blackhawk, 14 September 2018 - 01:24 PM.

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Mother_Of_All_Rommel #17 Posted 14 September 2018 - 01:28 PM

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Without doubt it reduce cw activity, thats probably the whole point of its removal. But at the same time increase WG gain. New plyr trying cw now needs a tier 8 prem to play it, or at least some strong tier 8 tech tree, and prem acc to fight in it.

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Run_Away_Brave_sir_Robin #18 Posted 14 September 2018 - 01:41 PM

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View Post_HoPeY_, on 14 September 2018 - 05:21 PM, said:

 

disAgreed.

T6 wasnt healthy long term for cws development. 

Noting the "long term" here. Games are meant to progress forwards. Not backwards. (and considering the aim of the game here is to play through tiers to reach tier X, having players stop at tier 6. Because tier 6 CWs, isnt exactly ever been good motivation. Hence the overall decision by WG (all of them) to remove t6 CWs from all servers)

 

Check.

 


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s70blackhawk #19 Posted 14 September 2018 - 01:54 PM

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View PostRun_Away_Brave_sir_Robin, on 14 September 2018 - 03:41 PM, said:

T6 wasnt healthy long term for cws development. 

Noting the "long term" here. Games are meant to progress forwards. Not backwards. (and considering the aim of the game here is to play through tiers to reach tier X, having players stop at tier 6. Because tier 6 CWs, isnt exactly ever been good motivation. Hence the overall decision by WG (all of them) to remove t6 CWs from all servers)

 

Check.

 

 

I fully understand what you're saying, but don't agree either with the logic of flogging a dead horse at Tier X when it is clearly not working for our small server population. This may of been a reason for other servers.

Again to quote others. Correlation doesn't mean causation???? Can been seen from both sides.

 

I do agree with some of the logic for the long term, and that teams would sit in Tier 6 and not progress. I get that. So force these high ELO teams up if they try to camp at Tier 6 maps? Like we've all said before, a sporting ladder of graded teams.

 

To me, I just think of CW as another game mode. End Game can still be Tier X and lots of rewards. Just include the small clans what want to play a game mode, rather than an end game. Otherwise the numbers keep dropping.

 

And from the forums, unless you are a self appointed elite, apparently your input isn't valid.


Edited by s70blackhawk, 14 September 2018 - 02:02 PM.

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Jezzalenko1978 #20 Posted 14 September 2018 - 02:19 PM

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Oh how I just love how ironic the graphs are, when it comes to the topic......  mttspiii - you are brilliant!!!!!  :D   Have my +1's for proving the logic behind most players preferences as far as CW's are concerned, regardless of the "forum elite" !!

 

 

View PostCenturion_IRL, on 14 September 2018 - 02:40 PM, said:

T6 clanwars didnt kill the player base, it killed clan wars and that is why thankfully WG got rid of it.

 

drop the mic, the proof is there - well said.

 

Oh the irony! :D






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