39 replies to this topic

[Aoyama_Blue_Mountain]

Wait wait wait wait wait...

 

How would you be expecting 25% of the time bottom tier when 7/15 is already 47%?

 

And due to higher XP for higher tier tanks, the most amount of grind time happens at tier 9, followed by tier 8 etc.

 

My IS-5 is the one rusting. My IS-6 is my 60% winrate source. My Type-59 is my 59% winrate source, I didn't even bother buying / T-44-100 due to the MM.

 

Pref MM tanks are doing well due to 357.

[CelestiaLudenberg]

"Preferential matchmaking tanks have preferential matchmaking because they have shit tier guns, so we are going to buff their armor"

[Ezz]

Aoyama_Blue_Mountain, on 08 October 2018 - 01:31 PM, said:

How would you be expecting 25% of the time bottom tier when 7/15 is already 47%?

My guess is he means 25% of all battles as the '7' in a 357. Ie with full tier and 5/10 battles + the 3 or the 5 in a 357 accounting for the other portion of all battles.

[Conan]

I was talking about 3/5/7 Template probability. Thank you very much. Let's please keep on the pref MM tanks please. 

[Aoyama_Blue_Mountain]

Well then definitely the expected and actual is wrong then since it looks like MM is trying as hard as possible to do even 3:3:9 just to make +2 MM possible.

 

On pref MM tanks, if all tanks are getting 5:10 MM majority of the time (and I assume bottom tier most of the time because SBMM or whatever), then I will stop playing pref MM tanks (and switch to a non-pref counterpart which probably exists) and agree that they are underpowered, because they do not give any advantage over normal MM tanks except for... Let's say 20% of the time.

 

But fact remains that this server is being screwed by 357MM and hence pref MM tanks are thriving. If you sell a tank whose difference is the MM it receives then it is natural that the value and balance of the tank depends on the MM meta.

 

Or let me put it this way

 

I don't see a difference in difficulty between a 175mm - 200mm pen gun trying to shoot tier 9 compared to a 200mm - 225mm pen gun trying to shoot tier X.

 

Years of IS-6 and Superpershing had already thought me that 170mm is sufficient to pen pretty much everything if you aim their sides. Until Obj. 257 came anyway.

Edited by Aoyama_Blue_Mountain, 08 October 2018 - 04:00 PM.

[StormCrowReaperManyHat]

Agree with most sentiments here, the wrong things are being buffed in most instances and the pen changes while needed don't go far enough. The abundance of overpowered premiums released in the last two years has rendered the game absolutely incapable of being balanced without a complete redo starting with MM and then working downwards. I honestly would prefer to go back to the original +4 tier spread than suffer through more 3/5/7 bottom tier [edited]in perpetuity. Every single decision made in the last three years has been wrong.

[Ezz]

357 has brought about a situation with the PMMs where WG are damned if they do buff them to parity and remove pmm and damned if they don't as they still will get screwed by 357.

[CelestiaLudenberg]

For the HT's with the 122mm's, the issue for me was never the penetration, 175 is more than usable with pref MM, it is the fact that you have to aim for 5 years only to still miss the spot you need to hit anyway because 0.44 accuracy is a great idea.

 

Realistically the 181mm of penetration the Type 59 has is not really effectively any more, but it is so much easier to get damage out in it because you can actually hit your shots.

 

I'm not saying they need to be like the Rev/STG in terms of a 390 alpha gun at tier 8, but the accuracy/gun handling buffs need to make them usable, what's the point of a prem tank if you need to load more gold than standard because you can't land your shots where you need to.

 

Hell, a prime example is the WZ-120, it has 249mm of penetration, but it doesn't matter because the gun handling is so bad that you never hit the right spot anyway. In this day and age of making all tanks have non-penetrable armor except for the weakspots, you need accuracy/gun handling more than you do raw penetration.

[StormCrowReaperManyHat]

With +/- (or in the T-34-3's case just -) 25% RNG and the absurd power creep of tier 8 hitting weakspots is a chancy thing at best and impossible at worst because some things just don't have them. I'd be down for an across the board reduction in RNG by 10 - 15% but I doubt WG would because that would make the game more skill based and less random and hurt the bottom line.

[MagicalFlyingFox]

Ezz, on 09 October 2018 - 12:15 PM, said:

they still will get screwed by 357.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm 

 

I wonder what they could do to fix the problem

 

 

 

 

Hmmmmmmmmm......

[Ezz]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.... 

[FramFramson]

[ksthegreat91]

Diving through Reddit. It seems that all of these buffs are well received.

 

Type 59 and S Pershing got the best out of the bunch, saying Type 59 feels like a baby 140 and the other a hull down beast.

[mttspiii]

ksthegreat91, on 12 October 2018 - 11:16 AM, said:

Diving through Reddit. It seems that all of these buffs are well received.

 

Type 59 and S Pershing got the best out of the bunch, saying Type 59 feels like a baby 140 and the other a hull down beast.

 

Not many Mutant 6 players to assess the buff I guess.

[ELGaming_Night]

It seems so strange to implement these changes for pref tanks. 

WG opted to chnage the tanks rather than first changing the MM which ruined them in the first place.

Personally I think the Pref MM tanks were in a really good spot before WG ruined the MM.

[specialman1147]

I bought PVictoria and then look at Armor and that why i dont play wot since 1.0

 https://tanks.gg/compare/pvictoria?t=centurion-51

[Ezz]

specialman1147, on 19 October 2018 - 03:07 PM, said:

I bought PVictoria and then look at Armor and that why i dont play wot since 1.0

 https://tanks.gg/compare/pvictoria?t=centurion-51

 

Not that that relates to the pref MM tanks, but yeah, welcome to the WG power creep revenue department. 

[_CAD_]

Conan, on 08 October 2018 - 12:59 PM, said:

I was talking about 3/5/7 Template probability. Thank you very much. Let's please keep on the pref MM tanks please. 

 

@Conan, why did the Chinese medium 34-3 is no longer on the premium shop?

[Angmar_]

Consistently getting 5/10 tier 9 matches or all tier 8 and the kv-5 and jt-88 just don't cut the mustard. Everyone's firing premium rounds and your own armour still doesn't count for anything, but you're up against tanks that can go hull down against you and you can't pen them in return or if you can you have to hit a tiny weak spot that your kv-5 gun will hit maybe 1/10 shots if you're fully aimed and the target is stationary. Aim time and dispersion is still ridiculously bad for the KV-5 and other heavy pref mm tanks combined with their low pen.

 

Good luck trying to be an armoured tank destroyer in the JT-88, you can bully tier 6 and 7 tanks, but tier 8 and tier 9 will just lolpen your upper hull with premium rounds and render any attempt to pretend it's an armour tank destroyer useless, even some tier 7 tanks will laugh at it. The tier 7 SU-100M1 is almost as well armoured, but provides a smaller target, and when you're hiding the hull it's harder to pen than a jt-88 just due to the size of the gun mantlet in relation to the tank, there's much less flat armour to shoot. It has the same alpha but much better pen on its premium rounds, is more mobile and has better camo but never has to be in a 5/10 tier 9 match or in an all tier 8.

[Angmar_]

After thinking about it, my only real conclusion from the buffs to pref MM tanks, is that they've made them better against tier 6 and 7 tanks which wasn't their actual problem. The problem that pref MM tanks have is that they're bad tier 8 tanks and they are consistently matched against tier 9's and 8's and don't see many lower tier tanks which they are actually good against. Basically, the current match making system is the problem with pref MM tanks.

 

If they plan on sticking with this fairly universally dislike match making, then they may as well make the pref MM tanks as good as normal tier 8 tanks and charge a premium price for pref match making, as after all, you're paying not to play against tier 10's, not to get shit on by tier 9's and 8's.

Edited by Angmar_, 21 October 2018 - 12:43 PM.