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AI and MatchMaker Feedback Thread


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TheBudgiesmuggler #481 Posted 11 January 2019 - 08:02 PM

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View PostEzz, on 03 January 2019 - 05:30 PM, said:

Yeah the release note had a bit more on it. I lost track of the combo of templates it mentioned but according to a few people it's gone backwards a bit from the initial tweak, particularly on anz. 

 

The template on the HK is 4-4-7 for tier 8 in a tier 10

Twit_ #482 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:28 PM

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So you want my feedback eh?

Not impressed with the revision back to 3 tier MM.

 

Some things I will note:

Configuration changes for Hong Kong server
The 4-5-6 and the 4-4-7 template for Tier X vehicles will be added.
The time for assembling the templates will be changed, thus reducing the average queuing time.

  • I have only ever encountered the 447 template once in the HK server. The game is still prioritising two tier mm over the 3 tier mm.
  • Sometimes in the early morning you will get 357 mm in queue.
  • Tier VIII games on HK are enjoyable - but that has only been with the two tier mm system, not the three tier mm.

Configuration changes for Australia server
The 2-5-8, 2-4-9 and the 2-3-10 template for Tier X vehicles will be added.
The time for assembling the templates will be changed, thus reducing the average queuing time.

  • Playing ANZ, the server pop is still not large enough to facilitate two tier mm 75% of the time.
  • Queue times are worse(?) in tier X compared to the first iteration of changes - maybe to do with less tier X's being taken out of the queue in 3 tier mm compared to the 2 tier mm.
  • Playing tier VIII, you do get two tier mm, but that is happening on coincidence when other tier VIII games finish in unison.
  • I have yet to play top tier in 3 tier mm for any tier VIII I own on the ANZ server. But I have played top tier in two tier mm. This may be due to really low population on the ANZ server regarding lower tiers (i.e. VI, VII)

 

Playing ANZ is more likely to get you into a 357 match, and covering up this with the influx of Xmas players didn't last too long. Playing HK is more likely to yield competitive games, but there is bad ping there for most Aussies.

 

That'd be my 2 cents on this.



The_average_tanker #483 Posted 16 January 2019 - 05:01 PM

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So guys, i loved the first iteration of the mm changes. they were great. But it did not make WG enough money was not perfect and needed rework. So came the second iteration of the mm changes. i personally had a good experience with them. the first evening was good, i even shared my battles in a reddit post here: https://www.reddit.com/r/WorldofTanks/comments/aa18a9/mm_update_on_asia/

but it looked too positive and may have been confirmation bias, so i collected data about my battles. but the going was slow (even the results were encouraging), so i took the help of Nrick to collect data and collate it.

He shared the results here: https://www.reddit.com/r/WorldofTanks/comments/aeeh8z/new_asia_mm_compared_to_everywhere_else_with/

i shared them on the WG discord too.

 

But basically the mm is still way better than what it used to be. Sure +-2 is more common than it was in iteration 1, but it is less than the frequency of +-2 in the old mm. the new mm is imo way better than the old mm and i am enjoying my tier 8 prems a lot more. Just putting the data out there for anyone who missed it.

 

 


 

 

 

 


Puggsley #484 Posted 17 January 2019 - 08:29 AM

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I agree Twit, T8 MM is much better on HK server compared to the ANZ one. You are much more likely to be caught in a 3/5/7 game on ANZ. Will gladly change out to 130 ping on HK for better MM than stay on 15 ping on ANZ.

 

T9 is fine on both.  



K4BeeTee #485 Posted 17 January 2019 - 10:55 AM

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View PostPuggsley, on 17 January 2019 - 08:29 AM, said:

T8 MM is much better on HK server compared to the ANZ one. You are much more likely to be caught in a 3/5/7 game on ANZ. Will gladly change out to 130 ping on HK for better MM than stay on 15 ping on ANZ.

 

T9 is fine on both.  

 

I've been playing a lot more on HK for that exact reason. I'd prefer to play on Aus obviously. Id love to see how many people are avoiding the Aus server for this reason. The 1st iteration of MM had me mostly on Aus, the second one has me mostly on HK.



MazDar #486 Posted 20 January 2019 - 12:38 PM

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CardinalMite #487 Posted 20 January 2019 - 11:28 PM

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So tonight I  was timing out repeatedly trying to play a tier 8 LT on AU server during evening around 9-10pm Brisbane time. At the time there was about 1000 players online and the queue was consistently around 100.

 

I get that they have been trying to form tier 10 matches and fiddling with MM to do that but if I have to choose between tier 8 and tier 10 to not time out then I choose tier 8 over 10 every time.

 

Dunno it seems to have gone backwards compared to the first experiment with MM post 357 being de-prioritised .


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FramFramson #488 Posted 21 January 2019 - 09:01 AM

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It DOES seem like there's been noticeably more 3-tier games and most of those as 4/4/7 or 4/5/6

 

Still better than the old MM, but not really like what seems to be a slow backslide to try and get as close to the old MM as possible without triggering profuse server rage.


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CardinalMite #489 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:00 AM

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Weird thing is I have never before seen issues getting a match with a tier 8 when on AU with a 1000 players online and 100 in queue; regardless of 357  (or other templates in use) up until yesterday. 

 

Maybe current missions were skewing MM a bit but it was very surprising. Played a tier 7 and got a match inside a minute.


Edited by CardinalMite, 21 January 2019 - 11:02 AM.

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Ezz #490 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:30 AM

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As you note for the cop out balance classes (lights and arty) that are just mirrored per team you need something of the same class to balance you out. So not only is the mm looking for a battle to put you in but it's also looking for someone else. 

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CardinalMite #491 Posted 21 January 2019 - 01:28 PM

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True, this is why I  was wondering if current missions were skewing the MM too much for a low population server.

 

Fact is though the symmetrical MM for LTs and spgs has been around a long time and it only now appears to be a problem for tier 8 MM.


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FramFramson #492 Posted 22 January 2019 - 02:02 AM

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The MM WILL toss out the symmetrical balance if it's struggling to make up teams. You do sometimes see games where only one side gets an LT or an SPG or where the numbers aren't balanced.

 


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Ezz #493 Posted 22 January 2019 - 04:45 AM

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View PostFramFramson, on 22 January 2019 - 04:02 AM, said:

The MM WILL toss out the symmetrical balance if it's struggling to make up teams. You do sometimes see games where only one side gets an LT or an SPG or where the numbers aren't balanced.

 

 

It's more loosened to allow for +/-1 of a class. Sadly it mostly felt like the enemy getting the only scout in pork a lot of the time.

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spacewolf #494 Posted 22 January 2019 - 06:28 AM

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boonserm_juilek_warrior #495 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:19 AM

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View PostMazDar, on 20 January 2019 - 12:38 PM, said:

I only need a stable internet connection, the server is not always left behind

 



jf2980 #496 Posted 03 February 2019 - 10:43 AM

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I need my kv13 back plz buff it

 



Twit_ #497 Posted 03 February 2019 - 12:50 PM

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View Postjf2980, on 03 February 2019 - 10:43 AM, said:

I need my kv13 back plz buff it

 

 

Start your own thread my dude. This is for AI and Matchmaker feedback.

MarDurTaren #498 Posted 03 February 2019 - 02:23 PM

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I don't think the addition of bots to the low tier matchmaking has done anything to make low tier games more enjoyable.  The results are terrifying in their failure to address the issues of everything except match making times.  Here is a list of problems;

  1. Seal clubbers are now playing thousands of games in their premium low tier tanks because they know about half the enemy team are going to be bots.   They do this to attain unicorn status without any real effort.  They pimp out their tanks and then grind with the super fast matching to get their purple XVM colours leaving many new player wrecks behind them.
  2. Real players are targeted and eliminated first by seal clubbers.  They are technically the most dangerous even if they are new.  Thus the end of most matches is nothing more than a seal clubber in one of the overly numerous gold low tier tanks going around cleaning up bots that cannot make match winning decisions.
  3. Bots tend to move to an area and then simply shoot at anything that comes near.  They are not smart enough to do much more.  There is no way new players will learn tactics by facing these things.  They can't even hold still or angle their armour.  If you are going to include a Bot Mode then make it a "Training Match Mode" that has no effect on player statistics or wealth [positive or negative].  Make the experience gain in such modes 1/4 of normal so they really are not efficient at all as a way to grind your tanks.  Just a way to learn your newest tank and its quirks.
  4. People are padding their stats playing against bots.  This affects the appearance of the players in later tiers.  And the appearance of players to recruiters from clans.  You can no longer be sure if a unicorn earned his ranking or simply splattered thousands of bots to be purple.
  5. Once all the players are eliminated from a match there is nothing that can be done to influence its outcome.  The whole match comes down to the random number generators used by the Bot programming.  Its incredibly hard to be invested in a match than now 90% likely to end in either a seal clubber face off, seal clubbers cleaning up bots or bots duking it out alone.  That 10% chance per game that a new player will have a significant effect on the game outcome is not worth the time investment.


Puggsley #499 Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:42 PM

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View PostMarDurTaren, on 03 February 2019 - 06:23 AM, said:

I don't think the addition of bots to the low tier matchmaking has done anything to make low tier games more enjoyable.  The results are terrifying in their failure to address the issues of everything except match making times.  Here is a list of problems;

  1. Seal clubbers are now playing thousands of games in their premium low tier tanks because they know about half the enemy team are going to be bots.   They do this to attain unicorn status without any real effort.  They pimp out their tanks and then grind with the super fast matching to get their purple XVM colours leaving many new player wrecks behind them.
  2. Real players are targeted and eliminated first by seal clubbers.  They are technically the most dangerous even if they are new.  Thus the end of most matches is nothing more than a seal clubber in one of the overly numerous gold low tier tanks going around cleaning up bots that cannot make match winning decisions.
  3. Bots tend to move to an area and then simply shoot at anything that comes near.  They are not smart enough to do much more.  There is no way new players will learn tactics by facing these things.  They can't even hold still or angle their armour.  If you are going to include a Bot Mode then make it a "Training Match Mode" that has no effect on player statistics or wealth [positive or negative].  Make the experience gain in such modes 1/4 of normal so they really are not efficient at all as a way to grind your tanks.  Just a way to learn your newest tank and its quirks.
  4. People are padding their stats playing against bots.  This affects the appearance of the players in later tiers.  And the appearance of players to recruiters from clans.  You can no longer be sure if a unicorn earned his ranking or simply splattered thousands of bots to be purple.
  5. Once all the players are eliminated from a match there is nothing that can be done to influence its outcome.  The whole match comes down to the random number generators used by the Bot programming.  Its incredibly hard to be invested in a match than now 90% likely to end in either a seal clubber face off, seal clubbers cleaning up bots or bots duking it out alone.  That 10% chance per game that a new player will have a significant effect on the game outcome is not worth the time investment.

 

Its also ridiculously good fun stomping on the "unicums" you refer to. They are low tier specialists, have little idea of how to play against anyone who is not a new player.

 

Always good for a few giggles at the end of the session!

 

You have identified the winning strat in low tier though, eliminate the real players first. 



Sir_Direkin #500 Posted 04 February 2019 - 05:22 PM

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View PostMarDurTaren, on 03 February 2019 - 02:23 PM, said:

People are padding their stats playing against bots.  This affects the appearance of the players in later tiers.  And the appearance of players to recruiters from clans.  You can no longer be sure if a unicorn earned his ranking or simply splattered thousands of bots to be purple.

 

Sure you can. Just look at his stats in game. If the guy has a +50% WR and has thousands of games in low tier or stat padding tanks, and low to average win rate at mid and higher tiers, he's probably not that good. If he has a <48% WR, has thousands of games in low tier or stat padding tanks, and spammed gold in the game, you'll know the guy's a real shitter. Share the name with your friends and have a good laugh at his expense.

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