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Wheeled 'tanks' in Frontline


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LesterBurnham #1 Posted 19 April 2019 - 12:10 PM

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Wargaming, as a matter of urgency, you REALLY need to limit the number of wheeled tanks in Frontline.

Napalmer #2 Posted 19 April 2019 - 03:18 PM

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Nothing wrong with wheeled tanks in frontlines. If anything, I prefer having some on the team as they will usually go hunt down the clickers.

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LesterBurnham #3 Posted 19 April 2019 - 03:47 PM

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Hrmm - how you get to be a community contributor and you still call arty, 'clickers'? I expect someone who uses that kind of title to be impartial and give a balanced view.

If i wanted salty tear and crybabies, I'd jump on reddit....... 

 

'Wheeled' tanks shouldn't really be called tanks. They are armoured cars with rubber wheels that use a derp gun with laser accuracy with the armour profile of a medium. 

Because hey - NOT EVER in the history or [another game not worth mentioning] have armoured cars dominated the battlefield over tracks iron plate vehicles.......and wow, rubber tired wheels that bounce gold shells.......yeah. right, and moving almost too fast to hit. 

 

To make them viable, at all, WG had to make them OP.  Frontlines is FULL of these ridiculous objects. 

 

Please fix it so they are not every 3rd tank. 

 

 

 



XPAW #4 Posted 19 April 2019 - 05:55 PM

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View PostLesterBurnham, on 19 April 2019 - 07:47 AM, said:

Hrmm - how you get to be a community contributor and you still call arty, 'clickers'? I expect someone who uses that kind of title to be impartial and give a balanced view.

If i wanted salty tear and crybabies, I'd jump on reddit....... 

 

'Wheeled' tanks shouldn't really be called tanks. They are armoured cars with rubber wheels that use a derp gun with laser accuracy with the armour profile of a medium. 

Because hey - NOT EVER in the history or [another game not worth mentioning] have armoured cars dominated the battlefield over tracks iron plate vehicles.......and wow, rubber tired wheels that bounce gold shells.......yeah. right, and moving almost too fast to hit. 

 

To make them viable, at all, WG had to make them OP.  Frontlines is FULL of these ridiculous objects. 

 

Please fix it so they are not every 3rd tank. 

 

 

 

Because these days in society and tom [edited] and harry who voices an opinion that they have heard and does so with conviction can be given what they want. They have 1 arty per zone at start.. and he complains about that... but wheelies can ru from d to objective 5 and 4 and take them out before anyone else can get back there and that is ok



K4BeeTee #5 Posted 19 April 2019 - 09:59 PM

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mttspiii #6 Posted 20 April 2019 - 01:40 AM

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View PostLesterBurnham, on 19 April 2019 - 03:47 PM, said:

Because hey - NOT EVER in the history or [another game not worth mentioning] have armoured cars dominated the battlefield over tracks iron plate vehicles.......

 

South African Border War did let the Eland-90's make mincemeat out of T-34-85's. Against T-54/55's, well that swung both ways depending on the terrain's mud. And to add, the tankers did find the armored cars really difficult to kill too (because flanking, not because of wheel-shields), so their tactic was to fire underneath the armored cars to smash the cars' differentials, "de-tracking" them and making them much easier to kill. But yeah, wheelies changed the FL meta so bad, FL became bad.

 

And arty deserves the hate it gets in Frontlines with all those consumables they bring and how risk-free they play.

 

Nor could wheelies reliably kill clickers; wheelies are too blind.

 

TL;DR, wheelies don't do what they should (kill arty), they don't contribute to a firefight (rushes objectives instead of helping a cap), they instead do stuff they shouldn't do (rush objective and the only counter would be wheelies too). Objectives should probably have nearby bunkers armed with AI-directed HMG's just to swat off errant wheelies.


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Ezz #7 Posted 24 June 2019 - 10:13 PM

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Oh well looks like the wheelie thread everyone was using got locked so we have to use this which died a few months ago. Nice if mods merged the topics. The further irony is the poster probably could have been pinged for necroing this topic has they posted here.

Edited by Ezz, 24 June 2019 - 10:13 PM.

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mttspiii #8 Posted 25 June 2019 - 03:39 AM

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View Postmttspiii, on 20 April 2019 - 01:40 AM, said:

Objectives should probably have nearby bunkers armed with AI-directed HMG's just to swat off errant wheelies.

 

Just realized that, while good in theory, this unfortunately means the objectives would be vulnerable via blitzing only by LT-432's and LTTB's. And the future USSR wheelies.


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Holeinthehead #9 Posted 25 June 2019 - 09:26 PM

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View PostEzz, on 24 June 2019 - 02:13 PM, said:

Oh well looks like the wheelie thread everyone was using got locked so we have to use this which died a few months ago. Nice if mods merged the topics.

 

Well it was done by the same ........    person who put the thread on SPG changes into the AU / ANZ  Community thread . Until then i never knew the changes only applied to said community ...............................

Someone needs to get a hold of the leash methinks . I may attempt to copy past the entire other thread back into this one later .

 

And done . Threads merged !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 


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Holeinthehead #10 Posted 25 June 2019 - 09:35 PM

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PLEASE Wargaming limit the number of these wheeled 'tanks' in Frontlines!

 

They are an utter [edited] on this game mode.

 

Duplicate thread. Thread locked and moved to Locked Thread Archive.

 

The original post is here.

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Edited by Alita_My_Angel, Yesterday, 01:53 PM.

In agreement here. Mainly due to packet loss i was getting on the HK server making it damn hard to hit the little buggers.
Even for those of us with low ping, no packet loss, and are able to hit them find these little shits annoying. We all know why, so no need for me to rehash those reasons again.
Yup, they are a bad idea, REALLY badly implemented......

WG could add a few versions of wheelie rentals, that way everyone can drive them.

 

30 vs 30 frontline at 100km/h.

Also agree . Will finish this current lvl , then WG can shove FL . I enjoyed it before the clown cars .
Never happened, WG are infamous in denying their mistakes so they'd rather will let us in agony... 

But, but... WG is going to add the African wheeled tanks in the long run? : /

 

http://forum.worldoftanks.asia/index.php?/topic/84147-wheeled-tanks-in-frontline/

As I said back in April. Nothing wrong with wheeled LT.

View PostNapalmer, on 21 June 2019 - 07:02 AM, said:

http://forum.worldoftanks.asia/index.php?/topic/84147-wheeled-tanks-in-frontline/

As I said back in April. Nothing wrong with wheeled LT.

 

Hang on, you advocated a view range buff, and said they sucked.

 

 

View PostVindictus_Maximus, on 21 June 2019 - 09:16 AM, said:

 

Hang on, you advocated a view range buff, and said they sucked.

 

 

 

Sure did, but that's not related to this topic.

If I have to spell out EXACTLY what I'm trying to say, there's nothing wrong with wheeled LT IN FRONTLINES.

It appears many would disagree with you napes. For mine while they are annoying in randoms they are somewhat balanced by how few maps they can run riot on. FLs however doesn't offer that balancing factor. It's like always getting prok.

 

The underlying problem WG face is their impact on the game can't really be undone. WG would need to set a new precedent to change them at this point. But i guess that's WG's issue to fix.

 

Edited by Ezz, 21 June 2019 - 01:37 AM.

It really is easy to farm prestige points in frontlines by just driving around and being a pest in a wheeled vehicle, they do seem a little too good in frontlines, then again the LT-432 does "balance" them.

View PostAngmar_, on 21 June 2019 - 10:20 AM, said:

It really is easy to farm prestige points in frontlines by just driving around and being a pest in a wheeled vehicle, they do seem a little too good in frontlines, then again the LT-432 does "balance" them.

 

Except the LT-432 can miss. Those clown cars don't even when driving at full speed.

View PostAngmar_, on 21 June 2019 - 12:20 PM, said:

It really is easy to farm prestige points in frontlines by just driving around and being a pest in a wheeled vehicle, they do seem a little too good in frontlines, then again the LT-432 does "balance" them.

 

And therein lies one of the bigger issues with FL as a mode in general. The best ways to farm prestige don't really relate very well to the base game itself. I don't mean just wheelies here, i mean things like magic spells breaking vision, giving arty to everyone every few minutes, having so much of a focus on capping and resetting, rewarding a 'close' game rather than one where a team dominates etc.. While i'm sure some of it was by design, other elements just seem badly implemented. Eg, had they implemented two types of SS, one for spotted by a tank, one for spotted by a plane, you could at least help pubbies deal with broken vision better. Or have planes operate as if they were spotted for a moment (not for 20s or whatever it is) so SS works the same. Or better yet (as i've harped on about) they could just remove the magic spells altogether. Just like wheelies, they appear to break more things than they add.

 

View PostSir_Direkin, on 21 June 2019 - 12:28 PM, said:

Except the LT-432 can miss. Those clown cars don't even when driving at full speed.

Or crit for no damage and off it drives. My 432 now has a pub equipment layout and a FL layout to try to cope with them.

 

For mine another element of wheelies which wasn't all that well thought through by WG is that reward just yoloing about rather than thoughtful play. It's a bit like arty. While arty you can be clueless about the game and just click once in a while and have an impact, wheelies anyone with basic WASD can be remarkably effective despite having no clue what they are doing.

 

Edited by Ezz, 21 June 2019 - 02:52 AM.

View PostNapalmer, on 21 June 2019 - 09:14 AM, said:

 

Sure did, but that's not related to this topic.

If I have to spell out EXACTLY what I'm trying to say, there's nothing wrong with wheeled LT IN FRONTLINES.

 

This is the original thread you started

http://forum.worldoftanks.asia/index.php?/topic/83056-poll-should-the-view-range-of-the-panhard-ebr-75-be-buffed/

 

It was obvious (to me anyway) from the start that this tank was going to be powerful - buying the EBR was no-brainer. Yet so many of the youtube experts said it was weak tank (skill4ltu lol), I wonder how many of these complainers are just salty that they had the chance to pick one up for a bargain, but did not buy because they were poorly advised.

 

In Frontlines, I would consider the B-C12t the equal of the EBR, because it gets so much more spotting assist and spotting their own damage, and I see so many guys get General on the back of their LT-432s. Most of the complainers I see do not actualy own a wheeled tank, or play poorly in them. Thus the mentality of 'If I can't have it then nobody should have it'

 

My mentality is, suck it up snowflakes and buy one when it comes on sale again.

 

 

 

View PostVindictus_Maximus, on 21 June 2019 - 12:35 PM, said:

and I see so many guys get General on the back of their LT-432s. 

Raises another annoyance of FLs, there's no way for the players to see stats on it. For pubbing we can see easily which tanks are broken, for FLs, you have to rely on digging into post battle team scores and of course you won't get any real statistical basis for what you are seeing. Oh and fwiw as part of my 'are arty getting many generals' checks i seem to see more ebrs than 432s but i wasn't really checking those two so could be something as simple as which tank shows first.

 

Edited by Ezz, 21 June 2019 - 02:40 AM.

View PostVindictus_Maximus, on 21 June 2019 - 10:35 AM, said:

Thus the mentality of 'If I can't have it then nobody should have it'

 

It's not sour grapes when it's recognised as being broken in FL. It's like everyone can get arty, and I play arty occasionally, because even now it's still broken, and yet I'd also prefer FL without them.

 

The EBR 105 FL 10 will go on sale again, and I'll probably get it just for FL. They're a scourge, they're broken, that's exactly why I'll be playing it, and even when I have it I'll still think they should be removed.

 

View PostEzz, on 21 June 2019 - 10:30 AM, said:

Or better yet (as i've harped on about) they could just remove the magic spells altogether.

 

Just a reminder that when I played an early iteration of FL on the test server for season 1, it was actually a lot more fun when they hadn't yet implemented those magic spells.
Man, i killed a LOT of wheelies yesterday thanks to decent target leading and plenty of good luck (including a match where I killed all three of the enemy light wheelies) and BOY WAS THAT EVER SATISFYING.
Wheelies did lose 2 reserves, while almost all other proper classes gained 1-2 reserves each; shouldn't that mean that they're FL-balanced now?

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Holeinthehead #11 Posted 25 June 2019 - 09:36 PM

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Lights lost 2 reserves likely because they were over performing as a class -  a lot due to the EBR 75 I would guess. I'm no "good" light tank player but I achieved max prestige last night and a lot (maybe all?) of my "General" games came off the back of good EBR results. Heavies got extra reserves likely because as a class I would imagine they under-performed in front Lines - probably due to being left behind a bit. Was surprised Mediums got an extra slot as I would guess they perform well in the mode. 

Would love to see the statistics on EBR 75's in FL's - even though I love to go SPG hunting in them, or hunting for any isolated tank for that matter - if they are over performing maybe a cap needs to be put on similar to SPG's. 
 

View Poststewiejp, on 22 June 2019 - 07:20 AM, said:

Lights lost 2 reserves likely because they were over performing as a class -  a lot due to the EBR 75 I would guess. I'm no "good" light tank player but I achieved max prestige last night and a lot (maybe all?) of my "General" games came off the back of good EBR results

 
 

 

Same here, but only in attack and if you get a lot of capping points, but in general they are not that great xp earners

 

The 432s seem a superior FL vehicle overall, because they have that amazing speed, armor, and have the viewrange to spot their own damage and get spotting assist. That is one thing people don't realise about wheeled vehicles. They may be annoying, but their poor viewrange holds back their XP potential in a big way.

 

I check who gets the Generals in defence, and they are usually the autoloading meds, fast HTs and tracked LTs. Limiting the amount of wheeled vehicles would be unfair to those that paid money for them.

 

You actually are a pretty decent LT player though stewie BTW,

 

Edited by Vindictus_Maximus, 21 June 2019 - 11:46 PM.

My issue with the wheeled vehicles is being hit by them from 400m out while on the move in a Lt while they are doing a triple somersault with a back flip through the air . I have nothing against people who own them and play them . Their ability to auto target from a distance and do damage with performing gymnastics is just ridiculous . Hence the term clown cars .

 

Add the fact when you do manage to hit them it seems the tracks have magnetic powers and draw all shells for a critical hit . I've changed setups on my Lt tanks for FL just so I can specifically hunt these " clown cars " down and kill them .

 

The other issue showing in FL now is people creating platoons of these things and specifically going deep behind enemy lines hunting respawners and arty .

 

Bottom line is these clown cars need to be reconsidered . They do and are having an impact on the game .

Generally the people going deep end up with shit results though because they aren't taking action on captures and spend a large amount of time out of combat. Also, if they're killing an SPG. Good job.
Best just to wait until the caps are taken then go deep hunting. Then you won't be missing out on resets.

Edited by Ezz, 22 June 2019 - 07:31 AM.

Honestly the problem with wheelies in Frontline is less to do with wheelies in general and more to do with the ebr 75 being tier for tier arguably the strongest of the bunch. 

 

You hardly see the Lynx in comparison and even when you do they are nothing like as dangerous to deal with. The 2 shot autoloader and being covered in wheels,  makes the ebr a threat; whereas the profile of the Lynx is much less protected by wheely shields and it's rof is tragic.

View PostHoleinthehead, on 19 June 2019 - 11:15 PM, said:

Also agree . Will finish this current lvl , then WG can shove FL . I enjoyed it before the clown cars .

 

Lol maybe we can get clown car paint for them this coming Christmas.
I do agree that EBR 75 is abit OP when it comes to FL, then the Lynx was horrible in FL. Compared to Ebr, i say Su130pm and Scorpion G are bigger arse in FL.
Around 40 players in FL on weekend... we can see how good WG did with wheeled tank ;-)

Edited by Mystolin, 23 June 2019 - 02:27 PM.

View PostCardinalMite, on 22 June 2019 - 03:22 PM, said:

Honestly the problem with wheelies in Frontline is less to do with wheelies in general and more to do with the ebr 75 being tier for tier arguably the strongest of the bunch. 

 

You hardly see the Lynx in comparison and even when you do they are nothing like as dangerous to deal with. The 2 shot autoloader and being covered in wheels,  makes the ebr a threat; whereas the profile of the Lynx is much less protected by wheely shields and it's rof is tragic.

 

Drove the Lynx in FL, and it's indeed tragic. 13mm armor means overmatched by everything and an EBR will double-pen you with HE, while a near-miss by a bombing run leaves you semi-dead. Its top speed of 58kph is comparable to an AMX 40, while the LT-432 cruises with 70kph (for comparison, EBR 75 only has 60kph so an LT-432 can go orky on you and ram you repeatedly).

 

I'd rather take the Hotchkiss EBR to FL, at least it gets 40mm armor and 70kph top speed.

View Postmttspiii, on 24 June 2019 - 01:19 AM, said:

 

Drove the Lynx in FL, and it's indeed tragic. 13mm armor means overmatched by everything and an EBR will double-pen you with HE, while a near-miss by a bombing run leaves you semi-dead. Its top speed of 58kph is comparable to an AMX 40, while the LT-432 cruises with 70kph (for comparison, EBR 75 only has 60kph so an LT-432 can go orky on you and ram you repeatedly).

 

I'd rather take the Hotchkiss EBR to FL, at least it gets 40mm armor and 70kph top speed.

 

Yeah let's be honest, in FL terms 'wheelies' mean the EBR which is of course thanks to hashtag #wgbalanz# is considerably better than the lynx because reasons. Had WG not sold out to cash grabbing p2w a few years back wheelies may actually have been able to be integrated into their game without too much disruption. Sadly the die was cast and they'd already burned the good will required for supporters to buy tanks on par with the tech tree so anything less would get laughed at.
Yeah a Lynx driver decided to take a head on with my LT432 (didn't even try to avoid me) at top speed last night... it did not end well for him. Since I had CI The damage I took was negligible.

View PostEzz, on 21 June 2019 - 09:30 AM, said:

It appears many would disagree with you napes. For mine while they are annoying in randoms they are somewhat balanced by how few maps they can run riot on. FLs however doesn't offer that balancing factor. It's like always getting prok.

 

The underlying problem WG face is their impact on the game can't really be undone. WG would need to set a new precedent to change them at this point. But i guess that's WG's issue to fix.

 

Agree wholeheartedly Ezz

The wheeled tanks personally game me no problems, they can be killed easy enough. I think the problem LTs are the 432s - they are almost as fast as the wheeled tanks, but with amazing armor and guns. 

 

I would have liked an EBR. But I was one that  looked at how long that grind was to get that tank, and the extra cost at the end as well, and declined. Like almost all the other complainers in this thread - always nice to see a tank nerfed that we dont personally own, never grinded, never paid real money for.

 

The problem is not the wheeled tanks. They are annoying, but can be killed easy enough too. The problem is the game mechanics that allow the objectives to be killed so quickly. Nerfing the EBR would be a bad move

 

 

View PostHexHammer, on 24 June 2019 - 04:46 PM, said:

The wheeled tanks personally game me no problems, they can be killed easy enough. I think the problem LTs are the 432s - they are almost as fast as the wheeled tanks, but with amazing armor and guns. 

 

I would have liked an EBR. But I was one that  looked at how long that grind was to get that tank, and the extra cost at the end as well, and declined. Like almost all the other complainers in this thread - always nice to see a tank nerfed that we dont personally own, never grinded, never paid real money for.

 

The problem is not the wheeled tanks. They are annoying, but can be killed easy enough too. The problem is the game mechanics that allow the objectives to be killed so quickly. Nerfing the EBR would be a bad move

 

 

 

EBR is fun , LT432 is reliable and gets the job done and more usually . I agree with you ~
Happy for wg to balance all the prems to be honest such that they aren't objectively better than the tech tree equivalents.

View PostEzz, on 24 June 2019 - 07:48 PM, said:

Happy for wg to balance all the prems to be honest such that they aren't objectively better than the tech tree equivalents.

 

And unicorns fart glitter!

 

Couldn't agree more!


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Vindictus_Maximus #12 Posted 25 June 2019 - 09:38 PM

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I think we all came to a consensus that the EBR 75 was great for Frontlines, except if you don't own one, and/or if they rush the objectives and kill the game..

 

That's the sum of all threads in a nutshell, mods can now close this thread.

 

Edit, and the Lynx is not as good as the EBR

 

 


Edited by Vindictus_Maximus, 25 June 2019 - 09:39 PM.


Holeinthehead #13 Posted 25 June 2019 - 09:43 PM

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View PostVindictus_Maximus, on 25 June 2019 - 01:38 PM, said:

I think we all came to a consensus that the EBR 75 was great for Frontlines, except if you don't own one, and/or if they rush the objectives and kill the game..

 

That's all the sum of threads in a nutshell, mods can now close this thread.

 

 

 

Methinks you mistake we for I . A quick read indicates your consensus is not the same as ALL the other posters . Also as far as I understand it's the op who would request for the thread to be closed . It's the I we thing again ... you see ?


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Ezz #14 Posted 25 June 2019 - 09:44 PM

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Odd, the sum of the threads appeared more like that they were shit for Frontlines. And thanks to hole we can see that there weren't many who thought they were a positive.

 

The issue now however is whether hole will have to merge this into the Frontline issues that wg haven't done anything about thread.


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Holeinthehead #15 Posted 25 June 2019 - 09:46 PM

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View PostEzz, on 25 June 2019 - 01:44 PM, said:

Odd, the sum of the threads appeared more like that they were shit for Frontlines. And thanks to hole we can see that there weren't many who thought they were a positive.

 

The issue now however is whether hole will have to merge this into the Frontline issues that wg haven't done anything about thread.

 

Now there is an idea !!!


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View PostLesterBurnham, on 19 April 2019 - 03:47 PM, said:

Hrmm - how you get to be a community contributor and you still call arty, 'clickers'? I expect someone who uses that kind of title to be impartial and give a balanced view.

If i wanted salty tear and crybabies, I'd jump on reddit....... 

 

'Wheeled' tanks shouldn't really be called tanks. They are armoured cars with rubber wheels that use a derp gun with laser accuracy with the armour profile of a medium. 

Because hey - NOT EVER in the history or [another game not worth mentioning] have armoured cars dominated the battlefield over tracks iron plate vehicles.......and wow, rubber tired wheels that bounce gold shells.......yeah. right, and moving almost too fast to hit. 

 

To make them viable, at all, WG had to make them OP.  Frontlines is FULL of these ridiculous objects. 

 

Please fix it so they are not every 3rd tank. 

 

 

 

 

Wheelers are so OP that I wish I had such a vehicle on the roads now. It goes as fast forward as backwards for some models. They turn so effortlessly. They can aim so easily. Yes they have no armour, but so what? If you cant hit them, who needs armour? They seriously have to nerf them. Armoured cars have not been the OP weapon of any armoured conflict. I hate them so much I have thought of just quiting the game. I want to play a few battles and have some fun, not get out scouted by the OP crazy speedsters. 



mttspiii #17 Posted 03 July 2019 - 05:20 AM

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^African Bush War, where South African wheelies inflicted a kill ratio on T-34's not seen since WWII. And decisively blunted T-54 advances as well.

 

T-54 drivers learned to load HE and aim underneath the suspension instead of directly using AP on center mass. Worked for them, and surprisingly works for us too.


I'm fierce and I'm feeling mighty,

I'm a golden girl, I'm an Aphrodite

 

 


Mystolin #18 Posted 03 July 2019 - 05:50 PM

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Half of the time wheeled in both side just die in the 1st min and all of them is animal <46%.

WG did a great job to create animal tank for animal playing...

Maybe animal have same understanding.

 


Edited by Mystolin, 03 July 2019 - 05:50 PM.


Brave_Sir_Robin #19 Posted 06 July 2019 - 01:27 PM

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The maps this game uses were never designed for 79-100km/h vehicles. They are ridiculously OP - it is how WOT sells them, introduce new OP vehicle, $$$$$$ then once sales drop off they'll be nerfed. 

 

Rinse and repeat.

 

Once again, Wargames have shown they don't care fiddlesticks for game balance when they want to make money.

 

How ridiculously OP are these wheeled vehicles? Go watch Claus Kellerman's latest video. Make up your own mind.



Vindictus_Maximus #20 Posted 06 July 2019 - 04:39 PM

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View PostBrave_Sir_Robin, on 06 July 2019 - 01:27 PM, said:

The maps this game uses were never designed for 79-100km/h vehicles. They are ridiculously OP - it is how WOT sells them, introduce new OP vehicle, $$$$$$ then once sales drop off they'll be nerfed. 

 

 

Grind out the line and then come back and show us your stats ... show us how OP these tanks are.

 

If you are having trouble in the Panhard, it does not get better.

 

The wheeled tanks are not OP, they are just strong in skilled hands. Like most tanks


Edited by Vindictus_Maximus, 06 July 2019 - 04:40 PM.





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