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I don't know whether to be happy or mad...


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FramFramson #1 Posted 02 August 2020 - 12:17 PM

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Lately it seems if I get into a losing streak or I'm getting lots of misses and bounces, if I switch to firing all gold I magically hit everything, and do loads of damage.

 

I've always been in the school of "Carry a fair amount, but use it sparingly, when needed."; gold rounds are NOT magic, [edited]. I'd expect an occasional extra pen here or there. Not [edited] doubling (or more) my WN8, damage, kills, etc.

 

So I'm not sure how to feel about this other than baffled. Only thing I can guess is that with 240 being my standard ping, the faster shell speed on APCR gold makes a much bigger difference to me than it it does someone with average ping, but I mean, this seems wildly out of whack even considering for that.

 

(and spare me the tinfoil talk...)


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steeve_old #2 Posted 02 August 2020 - 12:54 PM

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may be that its a bit of conformation bias /self forfilling  prophecy you feel the need to carry so you try a little harder

try unloading all your gold to see if your bigboy carry pants are gold lame or not



FramFramson #3 Posted 02 August 2020 - 04:27 PM

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View Poststeeve_old, on 01 August 2020 - 11:54 PM, said:

may be that its a bit of conformation bias /self forfilling  prophecy you feel the need to carry so you try a little harder

try unloading all your gold to see if your bigboy carry pants are gold lame or not

 

Considering I normally don't shoot gold at all most battles, I'm not sure how that makes sense?


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steeve_old #4 Posted 02 August 2020 - 06:15 PM

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was not suggesting you spam gold just that if you play without gold you can set a baseline for how much gold increases the wn8 etc  

CardinalMite #5 Posted 02 August 2020 - 08:42 PM

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View PostFramFramson, on 02 August 2020 - 04:17 AM, said:

Lately it seems if I get into a losing streak or I'm getting lots of misses and bounces, if I switch to firing all gold I magically hit everything, and do loads of damage.

 

I've always been in the school of "Carry a fair amount, but use it sparingly, when needed."; gold rounds are NOT magic, [edited]. I'd expect an occasional extra pen here or there. Not [edited] doubling (or more) my WN8, damage, kills, etc.

 

So I'm not sure how to feel about this other than baffled. Only thing I can guess is that with 240 being my standard ping, the faster shell speed on APCR gold makes a much bigger difference to me than it it does someone with average ping, but I mean, this seems wildly out of whack even considering for that.

 

(and spare me the tinfoil talk...)

Fram, shell velocity is a big deal and makes much more of a difference than many realise. Similarly the fact that auto-bounce angle is much more extreme with HEAT is also a factor.

 

Not saying that you should spam premium ammo, but if you are switching between standard and premium, you need to be able to adjust to the differences in flight speed. In some ways it would be easier with firing no premium than a mixed loadout, simply because you would not have to keep adjusting lead  of shot between the different ammo types.


Edited by CardinalMite, 02 August 2020 - 08:45 PM.

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AlexTheKid72 #6 Posted 03 August 2020 - 03:05 AM

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I like the 240 ping face-offs where you're both 1 shots. 2 seconds after you fire you die, and they hurahh .....

FramFramson #7 Posted 03 August 2020 - 03:08 AM

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View PostCardinalMite, on 02 August 2020 - 07:42 AM, said:

Fram, shell velocity is a big deal and makes much more of a difference than many realise. Similarly the fact that auto-bounce angle is much more extreme with HEAT is also a factor.

 

Not saying that you should spam premium ammo, but if you are switching between standard and premium, you need to be able to adjust to the differences in flight speed. In some ways it would be easier with firing no premium than a mixed loadout, simply because you would not have to keep adjusting lead  of shot between the different ammo types.

 

To be even more clear (since i guess my previous post wasn't so?) "Use it it sparingly" means in practise that I do not fire gold most games. This playstyle is why I current have 70 million credits, even after recently buying two new TXs (and have had well over 100 million at times).

 

After near 50k games like this, I'm used to leading my shots, having to account for both lag and travel time. Doesn't mean I'm all that great at it since I'm a spastic with mediocre aim and an embrassing reaction time, but I know *where* to aim.

 

That's the whole point of this. It's not that I never use gold, but it's never made a vast difference to my play or winning on the occasions where I did use it (which is what a person who understands that gold rounds aren't magical P2W rounds would know). Why is it suddenly making such a huge difference now?


Edited by FramFramson, 03 August 2020 - 03:13 AM.

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NameWasStolenStresslevel #8 Posted 03 August 2020 - 06:29 AM

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For me it would make sense that Gold shells would miss MORE in case WG was trying to profit from it. APCR loves to ricochet, HEAT have other tons of problems too. Depends on what tank you are playing/playstyle.

 

But you could be saying the true, no one knows. There is one way to scientificallt find out what is going on without affecting the tin foil and aluminy industry.

 

Go to the training room, shoot 1000 gold shells and write down somewhere the hit ratio. Then shoot another 1000 standard shells and compare the hitratio with the gold shells. Then make a data compilance and release in a full wistle leaf blow forum post revealing the dark secrets of gold ammo. Be aware of russian snipers or anthrax letters.


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danielcwr #9 Posted 03 August 2020 - 06:39 AM

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View PostFramFramson, on 03 August 2020 - 04:08 AM, said:

 

To be even more clear (since i guess my previous post wasn't so?) "Use it it sparingly" means in practise that I do not fire gold most games. This playstyle is why I current have 70 million credits, even after recently buying two new TXs (and have had well over 100 million at times).

 

After near 50k games like this, I'm used to leading my shots, having to account for both lag and travel time. Doesn't mean I'm all that great at it since I'm a spastic with mediocre aim and an embrassing reaction time, but I know *where* to aim.

 

That's the whole point of this. It's not that I never use gold, but it's never made a vast difference to my play or winning on the occasions where I did use it (which is what a person who understands that gold rounds aren't magical P2W rounds would know). Why is it suddenly making such a huge difference now?

I am in a very similar boat. On average I probably fire 1 gold round over 20 matches, but when I run out of AP on occasion, boy do I notice the improvement of gold rounds reliability.

 

As CardinalMite has stated, I think it has to do with shell velocity more than anything. With 230ms ping (I live in USA) leading can be unreliable despite having 50K games. Sometimes a slight deviation in ping will lead to a brief packet loss spike, which will cause the shell to come out either faster or slower than you are used to. Considering the number of fast tanks currently in the meta, it can be extremely unreliable to hit them if your shell flies less than 1km a second. With APCR shells this deviation in ping makes far less difference as your shell pretty much reaches where you are aiming instantaneously, so if even if you experience deviation in time to fire, the shell will likely still connect somewhere on the moving tank.

 

If you are not firing at moving targets, then that extra pen can make a difference. Remember this stupid game has -25% +25% rng on penetration values. I cant even count the number of times i have fired at a "green" spot on a tank, only for it to bounce or just be absorbed by some sort of CriTicAl HiT. Having even 50mm extra pen on a shell can mean the difference between penning and not penning when you are aiming at weirdly shaped tanks, as even though you might be aiming at a green spot, the shell could fly into a spot that is normally orange if you are using AP. With gold, almost all spots on a tank become green.

 

Anyway, keep it up man. I really respect players who use gold sparingly, as I feel like it completely defeats the purpose of playing a whole subset of tanks if everyone is going to fire gold at your "armour" anyway.


Edited by danielcwr, 03 August 2020 - 06:40 AM.

 


FramFramson #10 Posted 03 August 2020 - 09:12 AM

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View PostNameWasStolenStresslevel, on 02 August 2020 - 05:29 PM, said:

For me it would make sense that Gold shells would miss MORE in case WG was trying to profit from it. APCR loves to ricochet, HEAT have other tons of problems too. Depends on what tank you are playing/playstyle.

 

But you could be saying the true, no one knows. There is one way to scientificallt find out what is going on without affecting the tin foil and aluminy industry.

 

Go to the training room, shoot 1000 gold shells and write down somewhere the hit ratio. Then shoot another 1000 standard shells and compare the hitratio with the gold shells. Then make a data compilance and release in a full wistle leaf blow forum post revealing the dark secrets of gold ammo. Be aware of russian snipers or anthrax letters.

 

:D I appreciate this post.


LT-playing masochist. It's too much fun to be a mosquito.


mrdoobie #11 Posted 03 August 2020 - 11:34 AM

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It's hard to get a balanced opinion on topics around usage of gold ammo....most of the responses are along the line of "I only carry a few rounds", "only when I'm close to marking a tank" etc and highlight the advantages\disadvantages of various ammo types.

 

Missing from these discussions are those people honest enough to say they "spam APCR like a motherf...r", and thick enough skin to ignore p2w comments, yet I see many replays from unicums running a full gold load out.

Maybe these guys are just too busy to discuss their ammo usage.

 

This is an observation, and NOT a reflection of any responses in this thread, nor implying dishonesty\BS around gold usage.

 

Is using gold like fapping.....everyone does it but no one likes to talk about it?



nadoblabla #12 Posted 03 August 2020 - 11:38 AM

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View Postmrdoobie, on 03 August 2020 - 10:34 AM, said:

It's hard to get a balanced opinion on topics around usage of gold ammo....most of the responses are along the line of "I only carry a few rounds", "only when I'm close to marking a tank" etc and highlight the advantages\disadvantages of various ammo types.

 

Missing from these discussions are those people honest enough to say they "spam APCR like a motherf...r", and thick enough skin to ignore p2w comments, yet I see many replays from unicums running a full gold load out.

Maybe these guys are just too busy to discuss their ammo usage.

 

This is an observation, and NOT a reflection of any responses in this thread, nor implying dishonesty\BS around gold usage.

 

Is using gold like fapping.....everyone does it but no one likes to talk about it?

I run full HESH on FV4005 and full premium HE on Type 5 heavy. Common Test server of course. 

 

I mean, premium HE is fun :D



FramFramson #13 Posted Yesterday, 02:42 AM

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Yeah, I run full gold on certain tanks like the Death Star (well, it has 2 standard rounds) for the troll value.

 

Including all my SPGs. If yer gonna be a salt-farming button-presser...


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