59 replies to this topic

[Danek9t]

I like it the time when the game felt really fair and interesting, the times where wargaming would set up possible challenges for F2p players to gain a decent premium tanks or at least a collection where we can enjoy. i have spent money on this game, yes, tried E25, do a bunch of the event, but as time progresses, the challenges on gaining these premium tanks became closer to impossible unless you choose to play the game so much you didnt realise how much time passed, at this point, im just thinking whether i should just continue playing this game or abandoned it altogether.

 

Q : Is The Game Prone to P2W area or F2P area?
A : i cant say much about this as the fact is already there, the game is closer to P2W than F2P, with itself still offering a bit to F2P players, my reasons can be placed in here

 

P2W benefits and offers :
- A decent starter tanks with premium labels

- Sometimes sells overpowered tanks to players which increase their competitiveness 

- Quicker Levelling and Credits Gathering

- promotes overusage of premium shells,
- increases players who would pay more to win than casual player (good for business, bad for player base under a lot of condition)

 

F2P benefits and offer:

- Free Tanks through mission marathon,

- Fun event that helps increases credits and exp gains

- can be good game to play during casual time

 

problems :

- P2W offers greater gains in terms of credits and golds

- Mission Marathon free tanks that can be considered as reliable are lesser than ones offered for P2W
- Sometimes when a limited marathon event is started (such as 122 TM recently) some people do not have enough time to get the tank for free despite getting the other non tank rewards.

- some event are more time consuming compare to other events and can take more than the given deadline to complete,

- F2P could not use too much premium shells compare to P2W which means it promotes greater advantages for the P2W players

 

for your sake of mentality, please focus on this game, take your time off, drink some water and probably watch something in youtube because this game is loves P2W players more than F2P players.

 

Q: recommend?

A: i recommend it a lot 2 years ago, but now, i think i would recommend it less.

Note for WG :

I love your game, yes but the time where i could enjoy this game is gone now, a friend of mine who is an avid tanker decides to 100% abandoned the game completely ever since the game becoming too unbearable and mentally exhausting, and i think i might do the same thing soon when THAT time comes. this is a game that is just a shell of what it used to be now and im sad about it. i will still take some time to play, but if the game chose to side with money, i will be going to give mine to a game that deserved it.

 

for time being, i will give it 3 more months to see where the flow would go.

[NZ_Reaper_666]

Danek9t, on 23 February 2021 - 04:42 AM, said:

I like it the time when the game felt really fair and interesting, the times where wargaming would set up possible challenges for F2p players to gain a decent premium tanks or at least a collection where we can enjoy. i have spent money on this game, yes, tried E25, do a bunch of the event, but as time progresses, the challenges on gaining these premium tanks became closer to impossible unless you choose to play the game so much you didnt realise how much time passed, at this point, im just thinking whether i should just continue playing this game or abandoned it altogether.

 

Q : Is The Game Prone to P2W area or F2P area?
A : i cant say much about this as the fact is already there, the game is closer to P2W than F2P, with itself still offering a bit to F2P players, my reasons can be placed in here

 

P2W benefits and offers :
- A decent starter tanks with premium labels

- Sometimes sells overpowered tanks to players which increase their competitiveness 

- Quicker Levelling and Credits Gathering

- promotes overusage of premium shells,
- increases players who would pay more to win than casual player (good for business, bad for player base under a lot of condition)

 

F2P benefits and offer:

- Free Tanks through mission marathon,

- Fun event that helps increases credits and exp gains

- can be good game to play during casual time

 

problems :

- P2W offers greater gains in terms of credits and golds

- Mission Marathon free tanks that can be considered as reliable are lesser than ones offered for P2W
- Sometimes when a limited marathon event is started (such as 122 TM recently) some people do not have enough time to get the tank for free despite getting the other non tank rewards.

- some event are more time consuming compare to other events and can take more than the given deadline to complete,

- F2P could not use too much premium shells compare to P2W which means it promotes greater advantages for the P2W players

 

for your sake of mentality, please focus on this game, take your time off, drink some water and probably watch something in youtube because this game is loves P2W players more than F2P players.

 

Q: recommend?

A: i recommend it a lot 2 years ago, but now, i think i would recommend it less.

Note for WG :

I love your game, yes but the time where i could enjoy this game is gone now, a friend of mine who is an avid tanker decides to 100% abandoned the game completely ever since the game becoming too unbearable and mentally exhausting, and i think i might do the same thing soon when THAT time comes. this is a game that is just a shell of what it used to be now and im sad about it. i will still take some time to play, but if the game chose to side with money, i will be going to give mine to a game that deserved it.

 

for time being, i will give it 3 more months to see where the flow would go.

 

I have dumb loads of money into the game. last i count i had 33 prem tanks, way to many. i hardly play a tech tree tank at tier 8 not worth it. Was in game 36 hours ago 30 tanks only 4 were tech tree tanks with to of them being spg. prem tanks means you can fire gold and not lose money like you would on a tech tree tank. Game free up to tier 7 after tier 7 you would need prem days to make silver at tier 8. tier 8 you just cover your cost. at tier 10 you never make money. yes games pay to win. but wargaming gotta make money. so they market things to benefit income. i remember back in the day. prem tanks werent ment to be better then fully upgraded tech tree tanks. most of the prem tanks release the last 4 or 5 years are way better than tech tree tanks. 

[imma_rage_quit]

yip game was killed by its creators, purely because of greed

 

i remember a time when the sea (singapore) server had 30000 players on on average day. now if you see 8000 on HK it is a good day.

 

more often then not, new players grind up to about tier 5/6 then abandon the game because of P2W

 

[Ezz]

To be fair they've been shifting the game towards p2w for almost the entire 4 years you've been playing. It's certainly not a new thing in the last 2 years. Tho they have been doing more and more to make it difficult for f2p such as the current plan to remove a lot of good free stuff from shunter, fronties and the bp.

 

That being said if I were to try to pin point the biggest issue at present, it would be the ease with which new players and those playing like bots can make the upper tiers. It's led to lots of one sided battles. Throw in some crappy balance decisions wg has made over the years and the game can be very unfun.

[Puggsley]

It has become a lot easier for people to get quickly into the top tiers, with predictable results. Who knew that the deep end was deep?

 

Whatever new tanks are brought into the game, the actual fighting bit always happens on the same old maps with the same old corridor issues.

 

Vision saturation over the important bits means bugger all difference in each game. Its incredibly noticeable after coming back from a longish break. 

 

The meta of how to play is amazingly static. The new maps will follow the same path, a bit of a shit show until people work out the few positions which control the maps, then settle down into "the correct way to play the map".

 

Its one of the reasons why I have such a soft spot for lemming trains, its something different!

 

I think the huge difference between WoT and WoWS is that in WoT winning a small local area is largely a matter of technical skills like weak-point and basic mechanics knowledge  - armour and penetration mechanics. Once you are in position then its down to pretty much that. The start phase is limited to 3 or so areas which are largely static until they have been won. Flanking and other strategic decisions play only a small part of the game. 

 

WoWS has the aspect of technical skills, but also has a huge number of ways to outplay your opponent because you can always flank. An enemy in one location is often vulnerable to you moving around the map to negate that position, and not just from ships in the immediate area. Players with good map awareness can take flanking shots from a long way across the map. 

 

I suspect that it is purely down to the relative size of the map. Small maps naturally produce vision and combat corridors. Larger maps make a lot more of the map dark and available to use.

Edited by Puggsley, 23 February 2021 - 08:05 AM.

[FramFramson]

The one thing I will say is that not all marathon tanks are bad. In fact the offerings have been quite decent over the years. The 122 is nothing special, but it's at least a niche tank with a handful of strengths rather than being outright bad.

[Ezz]

44100, prog, ebr, reneg etc..

[LeSigh]

Bourrasque

[Aoyama_Blue_Mountain]

LeSigh, on 23 February 2021 - 08:52 AM, said:

Bourrasque

 

Bourrasque is good? We have a whole thread saying how bad it is and how bad me and vindi are at predicting tank performance.

 

http://forum.worldoftanks.asia/index.php?/topic/86460-yall-goin-fer-the-bourrasque-challenge/

[Ezz]

The main bone of contention (early on at least) was that Cindi felt it would surpass the prog. Pretty sure for average or below players that still isn't the case. Haven't looked at how their overall stats are looking tho.

Edited by Ezz, 23 February 2021 - 09:40 AM.

[LeSigh]

The tanks or Vindi?  Just you'd have to check Bolyx's newer reroll.

[Plutonious]

FTP players do have it rough, but often the tanks like Progetto that have been able to be earned are amazing.

 

All that being said, you've managed to get 13k battles in. That's more than 1500 hours of gaming. I think at some point you have to accept that spending a few $$ on the game is warranted given how much time you invest in it. Going to a movie in the theater pre-covid cost about $50 for tickets and food, for about 2-3 hours of your time. I think some perspective here is needed.

 

I think the bigger problems facing the game are:

 

1) EBRs have made the games much faster, while also making tracked lights pointless. Honestly I think the only thing to really save this is to remove them from the game.

2) Arty needs to be capped at 1 a game. Especially at higher tiers where the splash is so big that there is no safe spot on the map, getting spotted basically means death with more than 1 arty in a game.

3) Seal clubbers driving away new players. I'm currently playing low tiers again... for a "friend" for the recruitment program... and every game there are at least 5 players in the match with >20k games, almost universally in low tier tanks. These guys are driving around with 6 skill crews in their hetzers/luchs/t6 meds and just stomping the crap out of the new players. I genuinely feel bad playing the lower tier games, it's not fun bombing the crap out of people who don't know what they're doing yet.

 

The new player experience is -bad-. New players need to be protected from the seal clubbers, who are just killing the game at this point. Honestly I think the seal clubbers should just be thrown into their own matches against bots only, because they want an easy game with enemies that can't fight back. Just give it to them and get them out of the queue so the genuine new players aren't driven away until they encounter the army of M44s at tier 6.

Edited by Plutonious, 23 February 2021 - 09:59 AM.

[Ezz]

Tldr, going to the movies is crazy overpriced.

 

But yeah sadly suspect any chance of them removing ebrs is near zero. They painted themselves into a corner with those.

 

As to clubbers, the other side of the coin is how unenjoyable the upper tiers can be, plus are more expensive from a credit prospective. It's no surprise people shift to the lower tiers to have some fun. It's crap for new players but these days the grind is so short at least the pain won't last long. Not that accelerating new players into the upper tiers is necessarily a good thing either. But that's also an issue that wg is painted in with.

[Puggsley]

Aoyama_Blue_Mountain, on 23 February 2021 - 11:32 AM, said:

 

Bourrasque is good? We have a whole thread saying how bad it is and how bad me and vindi are at predicting tank performance.

 

http://forum.worldoftanks.asia/index.php?/topic/86460-yall-goin-fer-the-bourrasque-challenge/

 

Well misrepresented.

 

What you have is a whole thread largely about the nuances of each tank, how they are both good, but pushing back on idea that the Bourra is by far the best tank compared to the Prog, amongst others.

 

Currently the Bourra has a bit better win rate than the Prog, but by that metric neither come close to the powerhouses of tier 8, the IS-5 and KV-4 Kreslevsky

 

 

[AlexTheKid72]

Puggsley, on 23 February 2021 - 07:54 AM, said:

Whatever new tanks are brought into the game, the actual fighting bit always happens on the same old maps with the same old corridor issues.

 

Vision saturation over the important bits means bugger all difference in each game. Its incredibly noticeable after coming back from a longish break. 

 

I suspect that it is purely down to the relative size of the map. Small maps naturally produce vision and combat corridors. Larger maps make a lot more of the map dark and available to use.

Agree 100%.
Map design seems to follow 3 terrible rules.
1) Must have vision saturation.
2) Must have choke points.
3) Terrain must restrict dynamic gameplay.
Small, filled with no-drive zones, flat and foliage free.

There's no WAY any leader of a tank division would choose to fight where WarGaming put us, given the surrounding landscape outside some map borders.

Every update it feels more and more like the first Medal of Honor .... you get to look at a beautiful game map, but can only walk here and HERE! There's reasons every other shooter went sandbox - corridor gameplay sucks! (Except in Resident Evil 1 and the original Wolfenstein ....)

[Plutonious]

Ezz, on 23 February 2021 - 10:11 AM, said:

Tldr, going to the movies is crazy overpriced.

 

But yeah sadly suspect any chance of them removing ebrs is near zero. They painted themselves into a corner with those.

 

As to clubbers, the other side of the coin is how unenjoyable the upper tiers can be, plus are more expensive from a credit prospective. It's no surprise people shift to the lower tiers to have some fun. It's crap for new players but these days the grind is so short at least the pain won't last long. Not that accelerating new players into the upper tiers is necessarily a good thing either. But that's also an issue that wg is painted in with.

 

I mean, realistically the only one they cant remove is the 75FL as it's a premium. The other EBRs have effectively made the entire tech tree of light tanks pointless, which is a much bigger problem than removing EBRs.

While I agree that t10 is not fun, the clubbing is still not healthy for the overall longevity of the game. Yeah, you can move through the tech tree fast, but a lot of these new players are sitting at 40% WRs and just getting slaughtered every game without doing anything. They need to learn the basics before being thrown to the wolves. The clubbers should be forced to fight only other clubbers or bots only, they shouldn't get to feast on new players. I'm sitting here averaging nearly 1.6k dpg in my T6 medium with an 80% WR solo trying to get through the referral missions. Like this is fair or fun for the newbies I'm stomping on every match.

[Ezz]

In your recruit example you're essentially a new player if you're playing as the recruit. Not saying it's a bad example, just that the issue is more nuanced. I'm not really sure what wg can do. If anything they've focussed a lot on improving new player experience, yet it's lead to overall worse gameplay (imo at least).

 

For mine the onboarding issues have always been the learning curve is longer than most gamers expect and are prepared to persevere thru. Old result was people quitting in lower tiers. Wg 'fixed' this by drastically speeding up progress. Result is people now quit in the upper tiers. I guess wg hope they buy a prem or two first...

Edited by Ezz, 23 February 2021 - 12:29 PM.

[Plutonious]

Ezz, on 23 February 2021 - 12:28 PM, said:

In your recruit example you're essentially a new player if you're playing as the recruit. Not saying it's a bad example, just that the issue is more nuanced. I'm not really sure what wg can do. If anything they've focussed a lot on improving new player experience, yet it's lead to overall worse gameplay (imo at least).

 

For mine the onboarding issues have always been the learning curve is longer than most gamers expect and are prepared to persevere thru. Old result was people quitting in lower tiers. Wg 'fixed' this by drastically speeding up progress. Result is people now quit in the upper tiers. I guess wg hope they buy a prem or two first...

 

I'm clearly abusing the system in a way it was not designed to be used, and currently would circumvent whatever measure Wargaming put into place. But that's mostly because I want to get a specific premium which is no longer available through any means but the recruit system, which is probably a rare use case. I doubt most people would reroll a new account every few months just to be able to fight completely new players if wargaming implemented a number of battles threshold on the match making at lower tiers where people with >2k battles were forced to face only other seal clubbers.

[Ezz]

Fair question. If a player has already given up on the idea of the upper tiers then they aren't really losing much by re rolling. There's also the issue of anz during the day where bot clubbing is basically the only viable way to get a battle.

Edited by Ezz, 23 February 2021 - 12:54 PM.

[NZ_Reaper_666]

https://imgur.com/a/Ay86RKg heres the reason why i wont play low tier games they stat padding one guys got 4.5k games in that tank all in 54%wr players 3 real lights vs bot lights gg